N.Y.Lungbuster
Posts:189
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| 21 Jul 2010 12:42 PM |
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I just got back my mount from the 09 season and I'm not happy to say the least. When I took the deer to the taxidermist it had a 16-1/2" inside spread and about a 10" tip to tip spread. Now I get it back yesterday and the measurments are 13-1/4" inside and about 8" tip to tip WTF!!! He claims that they shrunk that much. There is also major hair slippage on the throat area that he claims was from dragging. I told him it was not drug anywhere it was shot and loaded onto a cart then loadad onto my truck still on the cart. So now he says ok maybe its fighting wounds. Bullsh-- I told him Looks to me like your tannery sucks. This is total B.S. its the first time I used this guy that was so highly recommended by a couple of friends. Now I not only got a messed up mount but I need to kick a couple friends in the ass to. SORRY GUYS JUST NEEDED TO VENT!!!!!!!!!! |
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| IF IT WALKS FLIES AND HAS A SEASON, I HUNT IT!!!! |
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swnoel
Posts:3550
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| 24 Jul 2010 06:52 AM |
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He either broke the skull cap , your mistaken about the dimensions, or you got the wrong antlers on the mount.
The antler can not shrink that much.
Was the hide really sent out to be tanned , was it a home tan or dry tan?
Slippage can occur very rapidly and anytime a hide is not handled quickly... most of the time this damage has been done long before the tannery gets the hide.
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Topgun 30-06
Posts:9668
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| 24 Jul 2010 07:22 AM |
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What swnoel said! How much did you pay this guy for that abortion? If I were you I would make the guy either start over with a cape he provides and correct the problems or go through the BBB and try to get it straightened out if he is at fault. I have an antelope mount on the way by UPS right now from a taxidermist in Cody, Wyoming that is top rated. His fee was $575 and by the time the taxes, interstate game tag, shipping box, and shipping fees are added to that, it is costing close to $700. That's a lot of money, but the guy has a panorama of a herd of antelope he did for the Smithsonian Museum in DC, stuff in the Buffalo Bill Historic Museum in Cody and he does all of Jim Zumbo's animals, so I know when this head arrives it will be what he calls a "blue ribbon" mount! I was in his shop twice before I decided he would be the "go to guy" if I got a nice buck last year, which I did. I had it to him within 3 hours of when it was shot and he also did the caping as part of that fee, so I know everything was done right.
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JHerdebu
Posts:30
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| 24 Jul 2010 02:37 PM |
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I don't like to comment on the work of other Taxidermists as a general rule. With all the problems you have listed I would first look at any pictures you may have of the der and look closely at the rack. Make sure you have YOUR RACK, sometin\mes errors are made, we do a lot of busines in a short period of time during deer season and he may have grabed the wrong rack out of God knows how many he had drying in the shop. Sadly, it happens you get 20-100 racks all hanging up drying and a couple tags come off and then you are stuck guessing which 4x4 or what ever is which. I take pictures of every animal that comes through the door, just to prevent something like that from happening. As far as the cape slipping, a slipping cape should never be returned to a client mounted in my opinion. If it was slipping he should have called you and let you know you needed a replacement cape when he relized there was going to be a problem. Cape slippage is caused by epidermal bacteria that is on all skin, all it takes is the proper temperature and the right amount of moisture and the Bacteria will multiply and degrade the roots of the hair and skin and it slips. The Bacteria is not killed by Tanning alone, they can survive it an attack again as soon as conditions are right. (IE. warm, moist, low light like along the hair roots.) Check to be sure the skin is actually dry and that it doesn't smell, if it stinks there is something far more wrong then just slipping hair.
Hope this helps;
Jeff |
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| Life Member and owner of High Plains Taxidermy, Bismarck ND |
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Topgun 30-06
Posts:9668
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| 24 Jul 2010 02:59 PM |
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JHerdebu---Just a quick question and that is, if tanning doesn't take care of the bacteria before the cape is put on the mount, what does so that the taxidermist puts out a good mount with no hair slippage or other problems?
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JHerdebu
Posts:30
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| 24 Jul 2010 05:47 PM |
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Posted By Topgun 30-06 on 24 Jul 2010 03:59 PM JHerdebu---Just a quick question and that is, if tanning doesn't take care of the bacteria before the cape is put on the mount, what does so that the taxidermist puts out a good mount with no hair slippage or other problems?
Okay here is a simple, all be it long explanation of what happens during tanning and how when things go wrong slip happens.
Taning does slow it down but I have had taned capes slip in my hands. Taning cures the skin through first pickeling and then by adding a taning agent and taning oil to stablize the cell structure within the skin. The "KEY TERM here is SKIN" The pickling part is really not much different then turning cucumbers into pickles. Tanneries and Good Taxidermists that tan in house add a Bacteriacide to their solutions to kill off as much of the natural bacteria as possible within the hair mass, because you can't tan the hair, because hair is already dead for the most part before you ever shoot the animal just as any other hair is dead including your own. If you take a piece of hide that has had the hair slip and proccess it and tan it you will still have leather.
The hair slips because the bacteria gets down into the hair folicals and destroy the rot ball at the base of the hair, literally it each the hair roots.
In a properly tanned cape that is mounted using as little excess water as possible and is dried in a timely manner after mounting the skin shrinks as it dries and locks those little root balls in in their sockets, (folicals). If the bacteria gets in before it drys and destroys the anchor point the hair slips and falls out.
In animals such as Pronghorn Antelope it can be very hard to prevent slippage becasue the hair is hollow and the temps are usually high during that hunting season and that gives the advantage to the bacteria because of the increased suface area access to the hair roots. There are chemicals such as Stop Rot that can be used help prevent slippage but the best way is to get the cape fleshed and salt dried or cooled and frozen as soon as possible to shut the bacterial action down. It can not work in a dry environment it will go dormant until moisture is found. Freezing won't kill it either, it will slow it way down just as salt drying will but it will stil be there waitting, just as any bacteria does on surfaces every where.
The key in handling hides as a Taxidermist is getting it from the client to a frozen or dry state quickly, from a there it can be kept long term. Most Taxidermists and Tanneries that I know of use a Bacteriacide in their rehydration solution prior to tanning, it doesn't kill it all off but it knocks the numbers down to control it. That is the best that can be done because we can't just throw the hides in a bucket of bleach water and kill it as it would destroy what we are trying to save just in a different way.
I hope this helps you to better understand slippage and how to try to help us prevent it so we can provide all of you with the top quality mounts you invest your money with us for.
Jeff
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| Life Member and owner of High Plains Taxidermy, Bismarck ND |
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Topgun 30-06
Posts:9668
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| 24 Jul 2010 06:54 PM |
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Thanks so very much for taking the time to write that excellent explanation. I would hope that since I took my antelope in to my taxidermist in Cody within 3 hours of shooting him and it was immediately caped that it should be a great mount. You may be interested in his work, so I'll give you his website. He actually has two, one for his sculpturing and the other for his taxidermy business. The guy is a real artist! His sculpture website is: http://www.jamesmarsico.com If you go into that website and go to the bottom left and click on the taxidermy website it will take you there. Then if you click on the wild sheep section you can scroll down and see the full mount of the BigHorn Sheep that Jim did for my buddy, John Beardslee, in 2003. |
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JHerdebu
Posts:30
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| 25 Jul 2010 12:07 AM |
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You made an Excellant Choice in Taxidermists, James does great work and is a very respected Taxidermist. Jeff |
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| Life Member and owner of High Plains Taxidermy, Bismarck ND |
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N.Y.Lungbuster
Posts:189
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| 26 Jul 2010 09:54 AM |
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Thanks for the explanation of the things that may have gone down guys. I know for a fact it is my rack because there was a hole in one of the main beams and that matches the many pictures I have of this deer. When I get a chance I am going to try and post a couple of pictures before and after so you guys can see this. Oh and by the way it was $550. I am trying to hook up with the freind that this taxidermist was so highly recommended by and make a visit together with pictures and then see what excuses he can come up with. |
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| IF IT WALKS FLIES AND HAS A SEASON, I HUNT IT!!!! |
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PVIGILETTI
Posts:943
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| 26 Jul 2010 10:46 AM |
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Lungbuster,who did you use ? |
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N.Y.Lungbuster
Posts:189
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| 26 Jul 2010 12:45 PM |
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PVIGILETTI,
Check your P.M.'s |
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| IF IT WALKS FLIES AND HAS A SEASON, I HUNT IT!!!! |
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Topgun 30-06
Posts:9668
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| 26 Jul 2010 02:34 PM |
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 Hey guys, my antelope came today and here he is up on the wall over my computer desk! He's 14 1/2 inches with ivory tips!!! |
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N.Y.Lungbuster
Posts:189
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| 27 Jul 2010 06:28 AM |
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Nice goat T.G. |
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| IF IT WALKS FLIES AND HAS A SEASON, I HUNT IT!!!! |
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PVIGILETTI
Posts:943
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| 27 Jul 2010 08:04 AM |
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Thanks lungbuster . |
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N.Y.Lungbuster
Posts:189
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| 29 Jul 2010 07:08 AM |
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 Before and after!!!  |
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| IF IT WALKS FLIES AND HAS A SEASON, I HUNT IT!!!! |
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JHerdebu
Posts:30
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| 29 Jul 2010 09:00 AM |
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Looks like the skull cap broke and they put it back together without either aligning it or they over tightened the cap down the center when they screwed it to the form and didn't realize it was broken when they sewed it up. The angle on the main beams is different for sure |
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| Life Member and owner of High Plains Taxidermy, Bismarck ND |
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Topgun 30-06
Posts:9668
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| 29 Jul 2010 11:44 AM |
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It sure looks like they broke it so badly that they didn't have any idea how to put it on the mount. The width between the browpoints on the mount looks wider than on the dead buck, which makes it appear they stuck each side on and made a basket rack instead of bringing the bases together and laying each side out so the spread is the way it was originally. Have you decided what course of action you are going to take?
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PVIGILETTI
Posts:943
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| 29 Jul 2010 04:15 PM |
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Lungbuster I'm sorry that looks like a differnt deer all together.Please make this guy fix that mount.It is a very nice deer you have buddy. |
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PVIGILETTI
Posts:943
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| 29 Jul 2010 04:18 PM |
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Top Gun very nice looks great Congrats buddy. |
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Topgun 30-06
Posts:9668
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| 29 Jul 2010 04:30 PM |
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Thanks and I hope he does get that mount situation remedied because I would not take that as a finished product compared to the deer in the first picture!!!
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