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ARs Have A Place In Hunting Camp
They're modern sporting rifles ... not military machine guns.
POSTED BY: Bill Miller
February 16, 2012
Sooner or later it will happen to you. One of these seasons you’ll be sharing camp with a fellow NAHC member who’ll carry an AR-style rifle into the field on opening day. What will your reaction be?
North American Hunter Editor Gordy Krahn undertook that experiment a few seasons ago. Without telling any of the other camp regulars, he showed up at his lifelong northern Minnesota stomping grounds to hunt deer with a Remington Model R-25 chambered for .308 Win. and topped-off with a red-dot scope. As you might predict, he faced an array of responses.
Youngsters thought it was “way cool!” Some oldsters asked why he brought a “machine gun” to hunt deer. Everyone was interested, wanted to learn more and definitely wanted to shoot it, but you might not guess some of the questions he heard:
“How far does it shoot?” Well, it’s the same .308 Win. as in bolt guns, pump guns, lever guns and other semiautos, so it’s effective to the same ranges as all of them.
“Where’s the switch to make it full auto?” Civilian sporting rifles built on the AR platform are semiautomatic-only firearms, just like your beloved Benelli Super Black Eagle shotgun or Remington Woodsmaster .30-06.
“Aren’t those ‘assault rifles'? That’s what ‘AR’ stands for you know.” No, “AR” is not an abbreviation for “assault rifle.” It stands for “Armalite Rifle,” which was the military predecessor to what’s more properly called today the “modern sporting rifle.”
“Isn’t that thing a machine gun?” Certainly not. Automatic firearms have been severely restricted from civilian ownership since 1934 and remain so today. The modern sporting rifle is a semiautomatic, meaning that it fires once each time you pull the trigger—just like the semiautos you probably already own.
“Those only come in .223 Rem. You gonna shoot deer with a .223 Rem.?” Manufacturers have geared up in a big way to produce AR-platform rifles in superb traditional big game hunting calibers such as the .308 Win., 7mm-08 Rem. and others. On top of that, they’ve created new hunting cartridges best suited to these rifles such as the .30 Rem. AR and the .450 Bushmaster.
“Can it hit anything?” The accuracy and reliability of today’s topnotch semiautomatic AR-type guns rank with the best of any other action. The Colt AR-15 and the M1A—both often mislabeled “assault weapons”—are the rifles most often used in marksmanship competitions in the United States.
Finally, “Don’t you know those aren’t meant for hunters ... just for war?” Fact is, more of these types of guns have been purchased during the past few years for legitimate sporting use than most other types of rifles and shotguns combined!
This last one really gets under my skin because it sometimes comes from older vets who brought home their Mauser-style bolt actions, “sporterized” them and turned them into the treasured hunting rifles of generations past. Why should the vets coming home from the wars they are fighting today not be allowed to hunt with rifles with which they’re familiar and most comfortable?
It’s almost guaranteed you’ll see an AR-style rifle in camp soon if you haven't already. I might even be the guy hunting with it!
Comments
By
lmccormack
Friday, April 23, 2010 6:34 PM
BILL, As a gulf war veteran,and retired marksmanship instructor for the Vermont Army National Guard,I saw first hand just what the AR modern sporting rifle will do.The M16A1 & A2 performed almost flawless after pounds of sand,daily cleaning & maintenance,and more abuse then the average hunter will ever put his rifle through. I'm sure the industry has fine tuned and matched the platform to give maximum performance to all the calibers.I've seen sub-half inch groups from the 16's,and have no doubt the sporter's will match it. Combined with the light recoil,thanks to the gas operation,and the recoil spring,Young shooters are going to love it! Just take a look at what the Green Mountain Boys & girls have done at the National Military Matches in Arkansas!Need I say more?Now to find out how it tweeks out with handloads!
RELDR / LM 4/09
By
jward5
Tuesday, April 27, 2010 10:20 AM
I am vet myself. And i know from useing this rifle that with the right ammo it is quit good at hitting what aim at. I think it would be best used for varmint hunting.
By
mcooper3
Friday, May 14, 2010 8:34 PM
I own the R-25 module in the 7.62 or .308 cal. it is the most accurate AR that I have owned . With groupings of less then quarter inch apart at 100 yards. I am very happy with this Remington and can't wait to get it in the field this fall
By
jswiney9
Saturday, May 22, 2010 11:15 PM
i handled one for the first time today and it seemed kind of cheaply made compared to other AR's. it was noisy (something rattling) and even the young man who was selling it for the store (who does make commission) advised me against spending my 1400 dollars on it because he owns one and has had numerous jams from his. i was sorely disappointed as i was ona waiting list and came in to pick it up. the camo had already started peeling away just from being handled at the store and i dont know what was making the rattling noise in the guns but i wouldnt want to be sitting for 6 hours, shoulder my gun, and spook a deer. Gun tests also ripped these guys apart. Im going to look at one at a smaller gun store and see if it feels/sounds the same as the one i saw at this larger outdoor store.
By
MTPete
Sunday, May 23, 2010 2:52 PM
I have had Bushmaster and DPMS AR's in the past for recreational shooting as well as home defense. I'd rather have an AR than a pistol for that purpose. However if you buy one it needs to be sighted in and broken in for about 100 rds before using it for hunting. I am planning on purchasing an R-25 in a .308 as soon as my ATV is paid off.
By
ajones iv
Monday, July 05, 2010 2:38 PM
as an oif/oef vet and a long rang shooter in the army i like this rifle i can shoot anything i can see with this one
By
clewis16
Tuesday, July 20, 2010 8:26 PM
i love the my new r-15 it is the vtr 223 with collasible stock just like my m-4 im a iraqi war vet as well and i loved my m-4 and the r-15 is just the right rifle for predators.would not trade it for any other varmait gun
By
brazier
Sunday, July 25, 2010 9:31 PM
I have no problem with it, its a very good rifle if its good for our military then it should be good for all Americans one for ever house hold.I support the military and the USA GOD BLESS EVERY ONE THATS IN THE MILITARY come home safe
By
rmartin32
Wednesday, August 18, 2010 4:20 AM
i plan on buying a dpms ar-15 5.56 but i was ondering if anyone can give me any ideas on a upper recevier cuz i plan on buying a 308 upper bt i have a funny feeling that i will have to buy a new rifle but i dont really want to but since the ar is a modular rifle an if anyone can give me a idea please help cuz i really dont want tyo buy another rifle if i dont have to
By
yotesmoker
Sunday, August 29, 2010 3:58 PM
i recently sold my colt AR-15 .223,( which i get beat on a daily basis from my wife), due to finacial reasons, but for the time i have owned it, it was the best firearm ever, my wife fell in love with it the first time she shot it and it was the one firearm that the whole family enjoy shooting..but now i have my mind set on purchasing a DPMS Panther .308, for the wife of coarse.
By
donaldnicholson
Monday, October 11, 2010 9:01 PM
Hi Bill, I own a Dpms LR-308 and it's a great rifle. I own the 24" heavy barrel version and it will shoot 1" groups or better @100 yds. I also own a Rock River .223 with 24" Hvy. barrel and it will also shoot less than minute of angle at 100 yds. Bill I also wanted to say congradulations on the sheep you killed in alaska with Hunt alaska with us. I just returned from a moose hunt with them. Killed a 63 1/2" moose with 27 points. I use my DPMS 308 to deer hunt with. 165 gr sierra SBT gets the job done. Thank's Donald Nicholson
By
rmanwarren
Tuesday, December 28, 2010 10:26 PM
My AR is strictly used for varmints & predators. I still like to take good ol' Trusty Rusty to deer camp. She has a nice shine with a lil rem oil, & has put meat in the freezer for 3 generations.
By
rmiller5
Wednesday, December 29, 2010 7:49 PM
BILL; I DONT HAVE ONE OF THOSE ARs YET I DO HAVE A SKS. LOT OF FUN IF A PERSON CAN SHOOT WELL THEM ARs FINE, IN COLO FIVE ROUND MAGS IS THE LIMIT FOIR HUNTING . GOR FOR GUSTO BOYS .
RMILLER5
By
rmiller5
Wednesday, December 29, 2010 7:53 PM
PLEASE EXCUSE MY SPELLING NOT GOOD AT TYPING
RMILLER5
By
michealwhelan
Friday, February 18, 2011 1:24 PM
Great view. I guess I qualify as one of the old timers. My current plan for the next gun is one of the AR style. Cool gun, (to quote the young uns), but more importantly they are accurate, rugged, and just plain fun. (Oh did say that, can't have fun at my age). First purchase will probably be one of the ABC's in a big game (308??) caliber, but then again the new 22 models have some real appeal and are a lot less expensive to plink with. I like the way you think and am looking forward to hearing the same questions in deer camp this fall.
By
tbrown29
Thursday, February 24, 2011 10:32 AM
everything changes in all sports whether some of us like it or not but if thats the way its gonna be thats the way its gonna be . its still about being out in the sticks with your buddies or families and sitting around the fire having a good time. doesnt matter what gun you bring
By
alderdog
Thursday, February 16, 2012 10:41 AM
rmartin32, it is a modular gun, but the 308 win is too long to function with the standard length 223 magazine. If you want to stick with one lower rcvr I would suggest 223, 30 rem ar, or 6.8 rem spc.
By
softail
Thursday, February 16, 2012 10:49 AM
I remember when I was a boy, and my grandfather lent me his H&R single shot , break action .410 for deer hunting. His words were-'' if you can stay quiet long enough , and get close enough, you won't need need a great big gun with a bunch of bullets.''
By
tbyers19
Thursday, February 16, 2012 1:20 PM
agree with you softail, I own the new h&r single shot 12 gauge slug gun for deer hunting & I just ordered the h&r single shot .223 I feel the same as you if you cant kill it with 1 shot stay home & practice more before going to the woods & if more than 1 of the game of which you are after come's in you just just take out 1 so you leave some for the next hunt.
By
phastings1
Friday, February 17, 2012 10:49 AM
hi ya guys 223 and 308 is differant rounds i have the butchmaster in 223 as in flordia the mag is 5 rounds. would like to up it up to 308 for hog and deer. 223 is just not big enought
By
Hunter1892
Friday, February 17, 2012 12:53 PM
phastings1, 308 is bigger but even a .50 cal will not help if you don't have proper shot placement. You can drop a deer with a .223, but 308 is more forgiving. Again, shot placement. One shot, one kill.
By
HAPARKS
Friday, February 17, 2012 4:20 PM
no thanks, i'll stick with my 98k for deer hunting. never thought it sporting to us a semi auto for hunting. but to all what you like is good enough for me. have a nice hunt.
By
mowgle
Sunday, February 19, 2012 9:35 AM
I'm a bolt action type of fan because I reload, but in most cases it is the first shot that counts the most. I feel any weapon that you can hit what you aim at is the right weapon for you in hunting game. There is room for new ideas and weapons in our sport.
By
mike6951
Sunday, February 19, 2012 4:43 PM
Well ,I thank there is nothing wrong with the AR style rifle.It's just a matter of preferenceor sometimes to give the hunter the edge . As we get older we sometimes have comensate for our slowing down .
By
Ken King
Sunday, February 19, 2012 6:17 PM
I really love my R-15 in 204 ruger best varmit rifle I own. It is very accurate with sub MOA groups at 100 yards.
By
tnylund
Tuesday, February 21, 2012 2:04 AM
T. Nylund
I own an SKS sporter model w/ standard chamber of 7.62x39. I don't own an AR/Mxx. The thing about using either is that we follow the state requirements of magazine capacity and that the rifle carries the nock-down power needed for the game we are hunting.
I know I can fire my SKS at 100 yds and tack bottle caps (1 in. groups). If you are comfortable shooting the rifle and it happens to "LOOK" like an "ASSAULT RIFLE", so what. The mag on mine is a drop-n-swap and I have a three round that follows the guidelines set by Oregon Fish and Wildlife regs. I'm legal.
This is a mute arguement these days. The rifle you choose to hunt with is up to you. I would not use my SKS on an elk, moose, or griz in any of their variations, but I would use it on any deer, antelope, sheep, goat black bear, and any predator.
Thamks for the platform.
By
garmstrong5
Tuesday, February 21, 2012 6:41 PM
im with T.NYLUND.I LOVE MY SKS,5.56$ 4 A BOX OF 20 122 HOLLOW POINTS TAKE DOWN MOST SC DEER,ALSO HAVE 154GR SOFT POINTS THEY ARE NOT TO BAD ON HOGS,AND IN SC WE CAN HAVE 10 ROUNDS AND UP. A POOR MANS SEMI AUTO, JUMPING HOGS UP A BOLT ACTOIN IS NOT SO GOOD...1 WITH TAPCO STOCK OPEN SITE& OTHER WITH FIBER FORCE STOCK&SCOPE FIBERFORCE STOCK IS HEAVY&HEAVY DUTY.
By
jlunceford
Tuesday, February 21, 2012 8:41 PM
as long as the gun is made in the u s a i am o k with i have 3 bolt action gun 2 ruger 30-06 an7mm-08 1 winchester 30-06 what i do not like is all guns made out side of u s a i thank we sportsmen should buy all we can from the u s a i know there are a lot of you have out side of u s a guns that is o k i am gust old school all of my guns are u s a made and i am proud of that
By
rloosemore1
Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:04 AM
I have a Panther LR-308AP4 which is a 308 also known as a AR-10. It is manufactured St Cloud, MN. I have some extras on it and I love this weapon. I am a former Marine and started out with the M1Garand which I also own and then went to the M14 before I I mustered out. Thes weapon I have is extreamly accurate and I reload all my ammo and this weapon functions as well with reloads as well as new manufactured shells. Like I said earlier I also own an M1Garand which is that old stand by 30-06 and this is one rifle I will never ever sell. I hope to pass it down to my 1 of my sons or my grandkids. It is one of the most accurate rilles I have ever owned using the metalic sights. Every time I shoot it and feel the buck and then the metalic sounding ping it takes me back to my younger Marine Corps days. God Bless all our service personal bring them home save and make sure we Americans never loose our rights to keep our weapons.
By
carmitage
Thursday, February 23, 2012 2:08 PM
I also have a DPMS Panther LR-308. I also have some extras on mine, jp trigger, harris bi-pod, so on so on. I have always been told by the old folks that hang around the gun store here that an AR will not be as accurate as a bolt. They didnt really know what to say when i came back with one of my targets and could put a dime over 3 different groupings at 200 yards. They didnt believe me untill i showed them the video evidence. Its the new thing for hunting, i love the ar's. You can do anything with them. Dont get me wrong i still hunt with a bolt to but they are my new favorites.
By
? ? ?
Friday, February 24, 2012 12:45 PM
i have been saving money to buy a standard ar 15 and am wondering what maker would be the most reliable
By
chadbowles
Friday, February 24, 2012 5:47 PM
I have ownd several Ar type rifles chambered in 223 and 308, they all have been very accurate rifle. I'm like alot of you if the weapon is accurate and you can hit what you aim at then use it no matter what others think.
By
bluehorse12
Friday, February 24, 2012 10:46 PM
I have an Olympic Arms AR 15 in 5.56 mm M-4 version. I really love it. Shoots well accurate and no feeding problems. I had a colt h-bar a number of years ago, won a few shooting matches with it.
By
? ? ?
Saturday, February 25, 2012 12:19 PM
my friends brother owns a s&w and around every other 5 shots it doesnt eject sometimes worse than that im just wondering if that is just a defect with that gun or if that model usually has issues
By
angler
Saturday, February 25, 2012 7:13 PM
Hi Bill I recently purchaced a DPMS rifle in 223 cal. very nice gun. Shoots very accurate great for varments using Winchester varmint loads.At 200 yards this gun is dead on.
Good Shooting Doc Hollida
By
whitetail2015
Saturday, February 25, 2012 8:51 PM
my girlfriends dad owns one i always borrow it. its the .223 stag arms great gun love it looking into one for myself! ar is definately the way to go no matter what your hunting
By
jnielsen7
Monday, February 27, 2012 2:35 PM
An AR type weapon is the right ticket for brush hunters, as you don't have the full stock (option) and longer barrel to contend with. With practice most hunters can come to point rather quickly, and eaven with iron sights and hit a target (not recomended for ethical hunting) at 300m. I have "zeroed" six rounds at .75" I myself love this platform. The main thing is match caliber to pray
By
? ? ?
Monday, February 27, 2012 10:02 PM
I think i finally have enough to buy one so this weekend at the gun show im going to shop around
By
imills
Thursday, March 01, 2012 4:36 PM
I own an AR 15 by bushmaster OIF OEF vet fell in love with mine while in the military this 223/5.56 is the best all around hunting rifle... living here in wv where a 100yd shot on a deer is few and far between the AR with a partitioned round is deadly and will take a deer to the ground as fast as any deer rifle I've shot.. of coarse shot placement is a huge part of it ..... who takes bad shots on deer ....the same people who thinks a 7mm mag isn't overkill
By
breitz1
Saturday, March 03, 2012 12:06 AM
I own a DPMS Panther L R 308 that I bought just for hunting.I have killed wild pigs and deer droping them in there tracks. It has proved to be a exelent hunting partner.
By
SFC B
Sunday, March 04, 2012 8:08 PM
I am lusting after the DPMS rifle folks are talking about. After 17 years in the Army I can vouch for how easy these weapons are to shoot accurately. Plus, the 308 round is muy versatile :) Maybe after my next trip to the sandbox :)
By
breitz1
Monday, March 05, 2012 2:13 AM
@ SFC B Thank you for your service. Take care in the sandbox.
By
whurd
Thursday, March 22, 2012 5:47 PM
only ethical hunters are allowed in our camp. this piece does not qualify. several hunters were killed two years ago with one of these that should not have been in the woods to start with. ( i was close enough to hear the shots and I do not ever have to again remember what I scrambled to avoid in the 60s.
mr bill
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