Hunting Forum

Yesterday, Colorado State Senator John Morse (D) introduced Senate Bill 13-196 concerning the "Assault Weapon Responsibility Act". It defines an assault weapon as any firearm except handguns, shotguns and bolt-action rifles. It makes you, as an owner of any weapon which it defines as an assault weapon, liable for improper storage which could allow a third person to come into possession of your assault weapon. It also makes you liable for a third person's actions if you entrust (loan) an assault weapon to them, or sell or transfer the weapon to them in violation of any state or federal law . Should you decide to sell one of your assault weapons, you must "use the highest degree of care in selling, transferring, distributing and storing weapons" and "receive information to have reasonable grounds to believe that the weapon will not be possessed by a person who may use it dangerously or unlawfully". Civil litigators (a nice term for lawyers) must be frothing at the mouth in anticipation of so much new business. This bill is wrong on so many levels, but establishing civil liability by poorly worded legislation, introduced by someone who is ignorant on the subject, should scare the snot out of everyone.

If you don't think Senator Morse does not know what he is talking about, this legislation defines a muzzleloading rifle as an Assault Weapon! Remember, under this law, an assault weapon is any firearm except handguns, shotguns and bolt-action rifles.

There are four other gun control bills currently under consideration in the Colorado Legislature. If you are a Colorado resident, I urge you to contact your state senator and representative immediately to register your opposition to all of the bills. If you not a Colorado resident, thanks for listening and realize that if Colorado can produce such idiotic legislation, just think what a more liberal state legislature where you live is capable of! Get involved!

A muzzle loader already falls under the classification of "primitive arms" , same as bow or cross bow . You can get them sent directly to your house with no paper work .

This is not a federal proposal. This is proposed legislation in Colorado and the following is a quote: "'Assault weapon' means a firearm that is not a: Handgun, Bolt-action Rifle; or Shotgun". That definition makes a muzzleloader an assault weapon. There is no definition or mention of "primitive arms". If you have a 10-22, that will also become an assault weapon. Even a semi-automatic rifle without a detachable magazine will become an assault weapon.

The proposal also states that a seller, distributor and manufacturer can only "sell, transfer or distribute an assault weapon only after receiving sufficient communication and information to have reasonable grounds to believe that the weapon will not be possessed or used by a person who may use it it unsafely or unlawfully". There is no definition of "sufficient communication and information", but I am betting a background check might (and I stress might) be considered enough, but you never know in a civil court. I am betting that you would no longer be able to get them sent to your house in Colorado without paper work.

Further, the proposed law allows you to surrender your assault weapons to local law enforcement or a licensed dealer and pay them to destroy your surrendered weapons.

I stand by my opinion that this is bad law, proposed by someone who obviously knows absolutely nothing about the subject. The opening in the door is almost big enough to get a foot in. As responsible gun owners and sportsmen, we must get involved.

What we usually find is politicians trying to pass a law to please registered voters or third party political action groups, and they really do not know what they are talking about in the law.

Cayugad, you are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, this bill has the potential to pass because the majority party in Colorado is now Democrat. Sportsmen and gun owners would pay the price for the actions of a few deranged people who are neither sportsmen or gunowners. Colorado has a longstanding heritage of hunting and association with firearms. Look at this as Colorado is the canary in the coal mine. If this happens in Colorado, just think of what will happen in more liberal states or the federal government.

While it is true this whole "assault" weapon agenda will get worse before it gets better, the cool head will prevail and the politicians will discover who really pays the bills. We do! U.S. sportsmen and women pump a lot of money into the machine. Our muzzleloaders, since they are not classified as a firearm should be exempt from this rampage for now.

I am of the opinion that there is always more than meets the eye when it comes to legislation. We can talk all we want but until a law is tested in the courts we cannot assume that something is included or excluded until it is tested. I have seen a bill that would ban all rifles of 50 cal or larger. There was no defination more than that. In the current frenzy of lawmakers to do something to curtail the insane actions of a very few, the extremists lawmakers go forth screaming to ban all firearms and scream louder than all others all the while having a troop of armed bodyguards at their beck and call. If these extremists get their way we and our sport are in danger. Contact your congressmen and women and express your views thoughtfully because this current administration also appoints judges. If we do not object to bad legislation we will be ruled by it when it becomes law.

I have a warning and some very bad news for all, not just those of us who are residents of Colorado.

First, the good news: A piece of legislation in the Colorado General Assembly which would have turned any firearm which was not a handgun, pump shotgun or bolt-action rifle into an “assault weapon” was withdrawn by the sponsor after he realized that even his own party could not back such idiotic and poorly worded legislation. Yes, a muzzleloader would have been an assault weapon in Colorado. In addition, the right to carry concealed on college campuses was not repealed.

Now the bad news: The Governor of the State of Colorado will be signing several new gun control laws today. They will ban “high-capacity magazines”, require that gun buyers pay a tax in the form of a fee for expanded background checks, prohibit and criminalize many forms of private transfer of firearms, prohibit online training for CCW permits and require the immediate transfer or sale of firearms if you are charged with domestic violence. Some of these are not enforceable (bad law) or cannot be enforced without some form of registration.

These “common sense” laws are the result of “a conversation” in light of “an overwhelming majority of the American public being in favor of stricter gun laws such as tighter background checks”. In fact, these laws were passed (rammed down our throats) in much the same way as Obama Care. They are poorly written, have far reaching negative implications (such as confiscation) which the sponsors tried to hide. They were short-set for committee hearings to limit public input, residents and experts were denied the opportunity to testify in the hearings while non-resident celebrities were brought in and given all the time they wanted. The longstanding rules for being heard and giving testimony were changed several times to tailor and limit input. No link to preventing violence was ever established. Massive public opposition from all corners of the state converged on the capitol, only to be ignored. I could go on and on.

Thus, I have come to my warning to all of you. Colorado is a beautiful state with a rich heritage of hunting, outdoor sports and the western way. What we have just witnessed in Colorado is a preview to what is going to happen on the national level. If it can happen in Colorado, you can bet that the anti-gunners will hold Colorado up as their poster child. A lot of money from out of state was spent here from groups like Michael Bloomberg’s MAIG and the like. There is plenty more money where that came from. Make no mistake, your rights are under a more direct and organized threat than they have ever been. You must get informed, you must get involved and you must get vocal.

There is already a move afloat to recall the President of the Colorado Senate (the Assault Weapon author and the one who orchestrated this debacle) and bring the laws to a referendum of the voters for repeal. The problem is that it is difficult to repeal a law, even a bad one. Wish us luck!

Sorry to hear of Colorado's plight. I do agree that the time to fight is before a bill becomes law. The really scary thing is those same radical politicians are the ones to place the higher court judges where laws are tested. We are paying for our inactivity of a few months ago. Yes some or even most of us did something but when I heard that some 67 or 69 precincts in Philadelphia PA had no republican votes, not even one, I suspect the whole election process. Taking back America one primitive smoky shot at a time.

I can't recall which state, but a bill was introduced that made "ILLEGAL" any long barreled weapon with a pistol grip stock, thumbhole stock etc, other listed improved features. But the one that makes any long barrel firearm with a "Bayonet Lug" as "Illegal to Own" by anyone. This makes any muzzleloading musket or long gun with that bayonet feature Illegal by definition and makes you a criminal and that revokes your gun ownership rights. If I find this email again I'll edit with the state info unless someone else has that info and would post it. We're under attack from the ID 10 T's.

NY.

NY what? made any long barrel with a pistol grip illegal?  Not true. The fact that they are flaming a**holes, I won't argue, but the former statement isn't factual.

The law redefines “assault weapons,” which now includes:

    Semiautomatic rifles that have detachable magazine clipsor any one of the following features: a flash suppressor, a folding or collapsible stock, a pistol grip, a thumb hole stock, a second hand grip for the non-trigger hand, a bayonet mount or a grenade launcher.
    A semiautomatic shotgun with any one of these attributes also qualifies: a fixed capacity of over seven rounds or a shroud that lets the shooter grab the barrel.
    Revolving-cylinder shotguns are also banned.
    A semiautomatic pistol with a folding stock, a thumb hole stock, a second hand grip, the ability to accept a magazine outside of the grip, or a shroud or a threaded barrel capable of accepting a silencer.

Looks like NY looked at the California nonsense. That is why I left California several years ago. Company moved me to Maryland. Maryland is getting stupid too, so now working on getting myself moved to Idaho where things are a whole lot saner. Have to admit the closest thing I own to meeting their stupid list is an M1 Garand, but it is only a matter of time before it too will “qualify”.

jack

Steve:

The law you quoted regarding redefining semiautomatic rifles as assault weapons is pretty scary. Thanks for the heads up. I am assuming that was a NY law you were referring to. That law makes just about every semi-automatic rifle an assault weapon since most semi-automatic rifles have a detachable magazine. Under the law you quoted, no other attribute such as a flash suppressor or pistol grip is required since it says "Semiautomatic rifles that have detachable magazine clips or" rather than "and". Is there anything else in that law or accompanying legislation that further limits/bans assault weapons?

This is exactly what they tried to do in Colorado but using a different definition of "any firearm that is not a handgun, shotgun or bolt action rifle". Fortunately, that legislation was withdrawn, but most of the others passed.

As we all know, this is a very slippery slope. All we have to do is look at what Finestein, Schummer and that ilk want to do coupled with them getting away with thumbing their noses at every gun gun owner, and the NRA in Colorado and NY and .......well I don't have to tell everyone where this is headed.

Folks, we cannot be complacent. Through legislation, like the above mentioned, our legislators have earned our distrust. Regardless of where we live, we must get imnformed, get involved and get vocal.

Yes Steve, those are from NYS - sorry I left out the site, this is the link that I got that from

http://cnynews.com/new-york-gun-law...lt-weapon/

It should also be noted that there is not a requirement to surrender such weapons if they are already owned.

Attribution:   http://www.governor.ny.gov/press/01...egislation

Assault weapons possessed before the effective date must be registered within a year and recertified every five years. Owners of grandfathered assault weapons may only sell out of state or through an in state federal firearms licensee. Under the legislation, the Bushmaster used in the Newtown, Connecticut shooting will be illegal.

But YES it is scarey and people really need to be vigilant and vocal - the antis sure are!

WOW. The news article says "detachable magazine or", the wow-me article from the Governor's office says "detachable magazine and". That one word makes a huge difference. A 10-22 would be illegal under the first but not the second. Either way, Steve I feel for those of you in NY: bans, registration and ammo restrictions. I had heard that NY pushed things through in a rush, but I had NO idea. Are there any challenges afoot yet?

I know this is somewhat off the Muzzleloading topic, but EVERY gun owner and hunter needs to know.

Yeah, finding ammo - forget it.

Remember this when Emperor Quomo run for POTUS...

In NY an M1 Garand is considered an assault weapon due to the fact it is semi automatic and has a bayonet lug.

Yep, that'd do it....

Bet if you talked to some old Japanese folks, German folks, etc. you would get a bunch that agreed seein' as how that is the battle rifle in WWII. Just saying. And yes, it is looking more and more like I NEED my M1.

jack