Hunting Forum

I live in New Jersey, and according to the local gun shop we are the hardest state to purshase a gun in. They said that we are the only state with state purshasing permits. Let me explain to purshase a long gun in N.J. we must apply for a permit that usually takes 4 to 6 months, this permit is good for any rifle as long as you do not move. If you change address you must start over. For a pistol you must apply for a seperate permit that always takes 6 months. That permit is good for one pistol only. I believe they will send you two or three permits at the same time all to be used within 30 days.

The reason I am posting this is because I live across from Pa. They just raised the amout of time a straw buyer gets for buying a gun for someone else. The gunshop said that in Pa. once you pass the Federal background check you can buy as many pistols as you want, file off the numbers and sell on the street for a profit. Sorry, but this has to stop. It is not the type of weapon that the criminals are using but the degree of easy it is to get them. This is just my opinion on all the new gun laws that are comming.

In your state what is necessary to purshase a weapon?

Joe Termite

 

 

Since I have a concealed carry permit, all I have to do is walk in fill out the form 4473, provide my CWP and DL so the dealer can photo copy them, pay the folks and walk out. I can purchase as many handguns, rifles, or shotguns as I want, just have to provide the same paperwork for each purchase. If I didn't have a CWP, the only difference would be waiting for the NICS background check, still no limits on number of guns that could be purchased at one time. The most I've ever bought at one time was two.

From the scenario you described, I'd say the problem isn't with the gun laws in Pa., it's with the unscrupulous gun dealers!!!!!!! Perhaps if NJ didn't have such restrictive gun laws, the situation wouldn't be as you describe!!!!!  BTW, I may be wrong, but I don't believe NJ is the only state that requires a purchase permit, I seem to remember a couple of other folks on here commenting about similar requirements in other states (all of them are Blue states).

Posted By JoeTermite on 13 Jan 2013 08:22 AM

I live in New Jersey, and according to the local gun shop we are the hardest state to purshase a gun in. They said that we are the only state with state purshasing permits. Let me explain to purshase a long gun in N.J. we must apply for a permit that usually takes 4 to 6 months, this permit is good for any rifle as long as you do not move. If you change address you must start over. For a pistol you must apply for a seperate permit that always takes 6 months. That permit is good for one pistol only. I believe they will send you two or three permits at the same time all to be used within 30 days.

The reason I am posting this is because I live across from Pa. They just raised the amout of time a straw buyer gets for buying a gun for someone else. The gunshop said that in Pa. once you pass the Federal background check you can buy as many pistols as you want, file off the numbers and sell on the street for a profit. Sorry, but this has to stop. It is not the type of weapon that the criminals are using but the degree of easy it is to get them. This is just my opinion on all the new gun laws that are comming.

In your state what is necessary to purshase a weapon?

Joe Termite

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So you think we should all live under the draconian rules where the government infringes our rights and in fact turns that right into a permission that they may or may not grant?

You do realize that filing serial numbers is already illegal?  Did the shop tell you that in Pa. ALL handguns transfers (except for a few family exemptions) HAVE to go through a FFL or Sheriffs Office?  So selling a handgun on the street is ILLEGAL.  They had to pass a new mandatory time law for straw purchases because the courts declared the old one unconstitutional.

Normally I tell NJ folks to move to Pa. where they don't infringe on our rights nearly as bad but if you think NJ firearms laws are a good thing (that's the impression I get from your post) you can stay there. 

Dale

 

 

We have a 2week waiting period to buy .and the back ground checks .That is in CA .

Missouri allows you to purchase any number of guns per transaction, fill out the 4473, NICS background call and if proceeded leave with your guns. Used to have to get a premit from Sheriff to purchase a handgun, that went by the wayside with the CCW law. Our CCW law allows you to carry concealed in your vehicle without a permit.

Here it is folks.  This is the way Hitler got the guns away from the people of Germany when he took power.  Along with registration.  This is one of the best ways to find out who owns guns for future confiscation of them.  I thought that New Jersey was part of the U.S..  Not a communist or dictator run country.

They can only get away with what the people allow who are responsible for those in power as they voted for them !

Well dale,
 
1.  I am not thinking of moving to Pa. actually I like N.J.and have said if you do not like it here,move.

2.  Really, I did not know that filling off the number was illegal, or selling a handgun on the street. Thank you for pointing that out to me.

3.  The government already knows where all the legal guns are.Or at least every gun that was regestered to be purshased. ( It is my opinion) that the problem is all the illegal guns that the criminals have. And it is too easy for them to get. Every night we watch on tv and this is just the Philly stations there is another shooting on the streets in Philly. These are criminals with ILLEGAL guns, not the guns of law abiding citizens.

So, Dale what do you suggest be done, if anything.  And do not say we should all have the right to carry, because we know that is not going to happen.

On the news today a news caster suggested that if they can not get the guns then make it illegal to pocess ammo.

Just to let you know I hope this does not get out of hand, because if it does then only criminals will have guns.

Again this is still a free country where anybody can give there opinion on any topic and this is mine

Joe

Joe, I used to live near King of Prussia so I know the Philthy news stations all too well. What to do about the shootings? Keep the bad guys in jail for one thing. That's the worst part of Philly's problem, repeat offenders. But it's not only guns, they kill in Philly with baseball bats (Eddie Polock 1996 I think) and just recently someone who was brave? stupid? enough to testify at a trial was beaten to death with feet and fists. BTW, you're buying into the 'illegal gun' thinking. The guns themselves aren't illegal, what is illegal is the mere possession of a firearm by a prohibited person.

My wife's cousin is a Pa. State Trooper, he spent some time in Philadelphia. He said whenever they walked into a bar, all you heard was thuds as everybody dropped their piece on the floor because they were prohibited from owning and/or carrying. Yet they did and the cops couldn't arrest them because they didn't see them with the gun, just a gun on the floor. Were do the guns come from? Stolen or straw purchases, which is already illegal. And the guys who dropped them on the floor probably had a replacement the next day.

An excellent source for gun laws and Pa. laws in particular is the website for the Pa. Firearms Owners Association website. (pafoa.org) Plus they're passionate about gun rights, there is a wealth of information there. Some hunting but much more focused on firearms in general. If you didn't know that filing serial numbers off was illegal, then there are lots of other gun laws that you are probably unaware of. And the Philly news won't tell you about them, they just scream for more.

Think about this: You own firearms so obviously you can clear a background check as can I. Why should you have to wait 4-6 months to purchase something and I don't. What's going to change in that time? How will getting a government permit stop you from any criminal act you intend to commit?

Dale

In Michigan you can now buy handguns from a FFL without first getting a permit to purchase. That law just passed in December. When you buy a long gun or a handgun from a FFL, they do a NICS check and you fill out a form where you swear you are a citizen and you aren't a felon or crazy. For handguns, you also have to send a registration form that you get from the FFL to your local LEOs and they register the gun with the state police. If you fail to do that, you will have an unregistered handgun and that's a misdemeanor. Long guns don't need to be registered.

Posted By rthomas4 on 13 Jan 2013 08:32 AM
Since I have a concealed carry permit, all I have to do is walk in fill out the form 4473, provide my CWP and DL so the dealer can photo copy them, pay the folks and walk out. I can purchase as many handguns, rifles, or shotguns as I want, just have to provide the same paperwork for each purchase. If I didn't have a CWP, the only difference would be waiting for the NICS background check, still no limits on number of guns that could be purchased at one time. The most I've ever bought at one time was two.

From the scenario you described, I'd say the problem isn't with the gun laws in Pa., it's with the unscrupulous gun dealers!!!!!!! Perhaps if NJ didn't have such restrictive gun laws, the situation wouldn't be as you describe!!!!!  BTW, I may be wrong, but I don't believe NJ is the only state that requires a purchase permit, I seem to remember a couple of other folks on here commenting about similar requirements in other states (all of them are Blue states).

About the same here, have only bought one gun at a time about the only differance. And I agree with RT maybe the Problem isn't PA laws and the dealers.

Here in MN. for long guns you can walk in show a legal I.D., pass the NICS, buy the gun/guns (I'm not sure if there is a limit on #'s) and walk out that day.

For handguns, if you have a CCW, you show it, and the rest of the process is the same as for long guns. If you don't have a CCW you have to go to your County Sheriff and apply for a permit to purchase, if the Sheriff qualifies you, you will receive your permit in 7 to 19 business days and it is good for a year.

I have a hard time seeing the PA straw purchase scenario described by Joe as a big issue other than in theory. I'm thinking that anyone continuing to buy handguns on a regular basis is going to come up on the Feds radar, and that person is going to be investigated. I also have a hard time imagining that very many legal gun buyers would risk that right for a few dollars in profit.

Joe do you have evidence that the scenario you described is a big issue? I'm not trying to say it never happens, but do have my suspicions about it being a large overall issue. 

Hell, I'm fairly certain that with the number of guns my brother and I have bought over the last 14 years since all of mine were stolen, we have to be on a Federal data base. I still try to purchase at least two per year, whenever I can scrape up a few extra bucks, and whether I need 'em or not. I guess now I'll need to concentrate on buying extra magazines at every opportunity!!!!

If you can afford them price gouging going strong here in St. Louis. I have been doing the same as for buying guns and I know that the Feds are suppose to destroy the back ground check info with in 24 hours but I don't believe they do or if they do they are keeping track of us some other way

After Obama's press conference and signing of 23 EOs about a 1/2 hour ago. I expect the background checks will start to take a much longer time for those who don't have a CWP!!!!!!!!!!

Guesss I never did answer Joes question: What's involved in buying a gun?  Here in Pa.  you walk into the store, do the paperwork (4473 on all guns and an extra Pa. state police form for handguns) clear the background check, and walk out with your purchase.  There is no limit on how many you purchase.  Private citizens can sell longarms to another Pa. resident without a background check but handguns have to go through a FFL.

The state police keep a record of handgun purchases and transfers (vile offspring of unmarried parents!) and have since some time in the 30's. The courts have ruled it's not a 'registry' since some family transfers are allowed without the FFL but that is legal BS.  So they keep it even though there is a state law that says no registry allowed.

A License To Carry Firearms (LTCF) is what most other states call CCW permit.  Pa is a 'shall issue' state, you apply through the County Sheriffs office and the cost is $20 for 5 years.  Valid anywhere in the state and many other states.  Last year, my wife and I both needed new LTCF since ours were expired and we had changed counties.  It took about a half hour total time from when we walked in until we walked out with the new ones.

Amazing how good our gun laws are when you consider how bad they suck in surrounding states.

Dale   

 

We have a two wee waiting period on all gun purchases here from a dealer .Suppose to go through a ffl dealer but most don't .As far as family to family no requirements .

Here it is actualy called a CHL (concealed handgun liicense) issued from 4 years, first time at $150.00, after that 5 years at $100.00 since the groundground check, just has to cover the last 4 years.
It is not requiered to use FFL person to person on any gun, but recomended. Until BO and F & F no limit on the number you could buy, still no real limit just expect a visit.
Just a phone call, for BGC if they are not busy, a few minutes. Paper (4473) work you are out the door. CHL just the paper work (4473), if they call for a BGC on a CHL holder, they will ask why they called, do they have some concerns about the person purchaseing the gun. I know, had that happen, the dealer was just use to calling, just didn't think about it and called. They ask if I had not shown my CHL, did he have concerns of some sort, what was the reason for his calling on a CHL holder.

I noticed that a lot of FFLs have no complaints about the proposed individual sales needing to go through a background check. I would think they would like that to be the law, since it would increase their incomes. Most of them already charge anywhere from $25.00 to $75.00, with the average being around $50.00 just to process the paperwork and run the background check for people who buy from places like Gun Broker. I can already see an entire new industry setting up at gun shows, where FFL dealers will have a separate booth set up just for processing the paper work, calling in the background checks, and charging the buyer AND the seller a fee!!!!! I also imagine that those fees will certainly increase well above the current going rates!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yeah, gotta agree with you about the dealers and transfers. Plus the government would then be able to track all sales. Gotta fight it, it's the first step on the road to confiscation. And I feel sorry for you folks with waiting periods, that sucks too.

Dale