Hunting Forum

SteelC,
Just a little side note for you to consider...the original post of the fella that "got taken" as you put it...was also his first post ever as well. Don't make illogical and uninformed statements without knowing all of the facts. I have killed eight bucks with this outfitter over the past six seasons. Noone got taken. It was a terrible hunt, with very slow deer activity, but that can happen anywhere on a hunt that lasts only one weekend. Be for real.

Also, the week before I had a close friend who bowhunted on property that this disgruntled fella's son hunted on while he was there, and my friend videoed a 160" 8 point just out of bow range. If you have too much spare time on your hands and don't have anything better to do, play solitaire or something of that sort, but don't enter into the fray and add fuel to the fire about something you are clueless about. I would suggest that you heed the footer at the bottom of your own post.

Just my suggestion anyway...

Hollywood,  I did not say anyone "got taken" that was someone else mentioning the fact that all of IWS backers were recent posters with very little if any posting history on the site except for this thread.  Your post "Don't make illogical and uniformed statements without knowing all the facts" shows that you do not follow your own orders/advice.

Also I mentioned that I have heard  people on both sides of the issue.  If you do not have anything better to do than insult or inflame or add fuel to the fire on a subject in which you are clueless please  take your own suggestion and play solitaire.

One of the main points is that for $1000 a DAY, the lodging and food were sort of the no where near what they should have been quality.  Some consider this a scam, some a ripoff and others find this to be just fine and dandy.

Now that it has been brought to my attention that most of the IWS fanboys are of the just joined or have only a few posts and all of the posts are in this thread type I am getting the idea that IWS might very well be a scam and the scammers might very well be the IWS supporters trying to protect their scam $ coming in.  Way to kill your cash cow.

PS Did I mention that you fanboys seem to know way too much info about a particular hunt without being there?

SteelCandy,

You're right, and I stand corrected. My last post was intended as a response to Ternera1. Please accept my apology for incorrectly addressing you. I don't ever want to carelessly throw out incorrect posts, as I see many of the "regular" posters on the NAHC forum have a bad habit of doing, thus my "Solitaire" comment.

As a new poster, most of what I have read from the regulars with literally hundreds and thousands of posts, appears to be a bunch of folks with too much time on their hands, giving their opinions on things they clearly have no idea what they're even talking about. Hey, it's a free country and all, and everyone can do whatever they feel like doing, but it comes across as ridiculous and unproductive from an outside perspective. In fact, many of the posts I have read come across as petty and childish. I'm just being honest.

You correcting my error and everything else in your last post was fine, until you also ventured into speculative territory, about a situation which you know very little about. If you had carefully read the majority of the posts regarding the responses to this hunt, you would know that there was at least one hunter who said he actually WAS on the same hunt as this disgruntled gentleman who started this whole thing out by calling a legitimate outfitter a scam. That hunter addressed the angry hunter directly, refuting many of his claims.

I also mentioned in my post, that as a responsible hunter, I made sure that I discussed this hunt with the outfitter to make sure I got accurate information before responding. A number of other hunters who have had very different types of experiences with this outfitter also alluded to the fact that they had contacted him as well, to see what in the world had gone wrong for this client on this particular hunt. This was so different than everything I have ever experienced or heard about this outfitter, that I wanted to hear what could have possibly gone so badly that this hunter would be so angry and upset.

I will say that, armed with about 1% of the overall picture, you're free to speculate that this is a big conspiracy and that we're all intent on covering up a great, big, giant scam, from which we're all profiting. Along with many of the comments that many of the regulars make on this forum, that is inaccurate and makes professional people like me shy away from being involved with this forum. I wouldn't want to waste my time bantering back and forth with folks who don't seem to be legitimately interested in the truth, but rather interested in continually "stirring the pot", and creating intrigue and deceit where none really exists. Many of the regulars on this post have done very little other than throw out random, verbal scud missiles with no particular objective or target. I have personally answered several of these members, and, of course, they never responded after I thoroughly answered their questions with the facts that I had gotten straight from Mr. Doty @ IWS.

Also, I'm not a "fanboy", but rather an experienced, legitimate hunter who has had many productive hunts with this outfitter, which is why I got involved with this whole thing in the first place. If you need to speak condescending to fellow hunters who are trying to add constructive input to this whole discussion, have at it. That diminishes you, not them.

I want to say again, that I am really disappointed for the hunter who started this whole discussion. He obviously paid a lot of money for this hunt, and due to all sorts of circumstances outside of everyone's control, he had a bummer of a hunt, to put it mildly. I know how upsetting that can be, but as I stated before, I know he could have handled this in a more constructive way other than labeling a legitimate outfitter, with a legitimate business, a scam. He can even consider it to be kind of a rip-off, from his perspective, but to be a scam, implies that the outfitter is a spurious fellow, intent on taking advantage of other hunters, for personal gain. As I have stated on this forum (add nauseum), after 48 days of hunting with this outfitter, I can personally, definitively say, that just simply isn't true.

This is a situation where a hunter didn't do proper homework to ensure that he was heading to an outfitting experience that matched his expectations, coupled with natural hunting conditions that further added to his frustration and disappointment. It all makes perfect sense as to why he's so upset, and I feel for the guy. I just wish he had used even a little of the experiences from his 68 years of life, to handle this volatile situation in a reasonable fashion.

Again, please accept my apology for incorrectly addressing you. That was careless on my part, and detracts from what I'm really trying to say.

Hollywood: I'm not here to defend anyone. I just remember..."when I read the first post... he just got taken".
If you understood those words as referring to a "scam", your interpretation was wrong. The original poster used those words not me. If someone thinks they were ripped-off, same applies.

Just as a joke(you are a hell of a fast reader) but, you said.... " As a new poster, most of what I have read from the regulars with literally hundreds and thousands of posts, appears to be a bunch of folks with too much time on their hands, giving their opinions on things they clearly have no idea what they're even talking about."

On a last note: I honestly compliment you on your good use of grammar and punctuation. I am very impressed with  your elocuent use of the language. And feel free to correct me if I made any grammatical or orthografical errors.

Ternera1,

Thanks for taking the time to clarify your position. To you also, I say, if I have misinterpreted or misrepresented you, my sincere apology.

Also, while I appreciate your compliment of my eloquent use of language, please know that I would never correct your or anyone else's use of language on this forum or any other one for that matter. My purpose for entering the fray was assuredly not to assess anyone's grammar or orthography.

By the way, for the record, I do like the footer at the bottom of your post! It's hilarious, and worst of all, it's true!! I hate to see where the next four years of this "idiocracy" is going to leave us! We need more patriots like you.

Hollywood,
I am sorry if you feel like I was the instigating poster when in fact I was pointing out that I had in fact been blamed for something I had not said nor type. You are the poster that made statements "play solitaire or something of that sort, but don't enter into the fray and add fuel to the fire about something you are clueless about." That in the views of some was a direct attack and was not needed. If you wish to claim the high road and say you are a professional that shies away from being involved with the forum then please act professional and not attack others that were originally neutral on this subject until "your side" attacked them.

I was not trying to be condescending towards anyone. I stated I have heard from 2 hunters that were unsatisfied with the lodging and meals as well as others that were fine with it. I mentioned asking more questions. It was not until you directly attacked me that I said I was said I was getting the idea that the possibility of less than 100% honest representation of the facilities was more and more likely ( not using the same words ).

You seem, by your posts, to be acting superior to all of us dumb hunters that have nothing to do all day but piss and moan about subjects about which we have no clues.
You state you have knowledge of what I know about this subject in general, that could be seen as an overreach or just being smug. As I stated before I have heard from another hunter that was not satisfied with IWS lodging and meals.

If you ever noticed I state when something is my opinion with such qualifiers as IMO, IMHO, I think, etc.

On a positive note, I am glad you and some of the others have had positive experiences with IWS.
I do hope we can leave all of this in the past and forget all such unfriendliness in the future.

SteelCandy,

I am now well aware that you weren't the instigating poster, and that is why I sent you a personalized post, apologizing for incorrectly calling you out. Again, if my post came across as unprofessional or as a needless attack, I also apologize for that. There is no need to needlessly insult one another at any time and for any reason.

I do disagree with you that you weren't being condescending by calling those of us who took the time to actually dig deeper regarding the original post and investigate exactly what went down here, "fanboys". However, it's not a big deal, and after going back and reviewing all of your posts regarding this topic, I do believe you were pretty much neutral overall and I don't perceive that your intent was to add unnecessary fuel to the fire.

Also, I definitely wasn't intending to act superior to all of the "dumb hunters", of which I am proudly a part. If seeking to be articulate and factual regarding what I write is acting superior, then I'm guilty as charged. However, if you read the quick, initial responses from the "regulars" on this post, you will see that throughout this whole thread they have often thrown out their opinions without doing any reasonable research at all. In fact, many of the statements they made were answered by other posts, or on the outfitter's website. With even a little bit of detailed analysis of the situation, they could have answered many of their own questions, and realized that many of their statements were inaccurate. It is that type of folly that I was bothered by, and was directly combating and addressing.

I did notice that you used the qualifiers that you mentioned, and I commend you for that. That type of dialogue is refreshing.

Thank you for your positive response regarding my many, excellent experiences with Mr. Doty and IWS. I, too, trust that we can all leave this in the past and forget all such unfriendliness in the future. That is always my intent. However, in any arena of my life, if someone carelessly and inaccurately seeks to besmirch a person or an organization that I know to be honest and legitimate, I will readily throw my hat into the ring and come to their defense. I despise injustice and public slander, with the intent to harm people who are doing their best to make an honest living, while providing countless others with wonderful, lifelong memories. As I have stated several times, I sincerely feel badly for this hunters and his boys, but I also strongly believe that he has handled this whole situation in a very poor manner, and started an unnecessary firestorm. If he would have conducted himself in a different fashion, I am more than confident that this could have had a very different ending.

Thanks again for your posts and your valuable input throughout this conversation.

I hope you have a very blessed holiday season...

sorry to hear about all the bad things about hiring an outfitter,i have never personally done it but thats mainly because it is hard these days to know who is legit and who is not.i read all the good and the bad in this conversation and i dont know if i will ever be able to find a good outfitter that isnt a friend or friend of a friend.once you lay down what can be a large sum of money you are going to always be rolling the dice unless you truly know who you are dealing with.as for asking all the questions well you can ask all you want wether you get the truth or not is an entirely differant story.

nice to see some harmony. Hollywood every post is well said , nice job.

happy Holidays and be safe

Bojack,

Thanks for your kind words. I'm hoping to meet you in person at camp in 2013. Doug has told me great things about you. I've met the majority of the group that you hunt with, and they are second to none. I hunted with them in 2011, and we all had an incredible time, and success was abundant. A number of the bucks taken on that hunt were excellent deer in every way.

Thanks again, and I'm glad we can all end this on a positive note...