Bojack
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| 03 Dec 2012 11:56 PM |
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SteelCandy@ the reason we sit for 12+hours in a blind, tree stand is take advantage if the rutting activity and the deer movement that comes along with the rut. Deer can and do move all day long during the rut which give the hunter better odds of seeing deer at any time. And yes it is a challenge to say the least.
It is a little different walking the woods to a deer stand. It is done well before 1st light and more often in the total dark of night. Most if not all have never set foot on the trail path prior. The outfitter marks the trail with reflector tacks which can't be missed when a light source is shined on them. The reflective tacks are on both side of the tree make your exit as easy as it was going in. But you must follow the outfitter detailed instructions on how to find the stand. If he tell you walk the edge of the field for 80 yds then walk it 80 yds. I bet if you used a rangefinder on it from start to finish it would be 80 yds on the dot. So if you are not following his directions and did t walk the route and distance and you decide to express you will be wrong and probably push deer from the beds. Believe me I don't doubt he had a miserable time and its my guess he made it miserable for everyone in camp with him. His lack of experience in in many areas lead to his expectations being something that were unrealistic He claims to have been a guide for 15 yrs in NY and has hunted many times in camp on his own with a map. Find that hard to believe most place I have been to and researched would NEVER allow that they don't want a cowboy walking around invading other hunts space and pushing deer to the next county. Trust me he is making this personal against the outfitter. I have heard from the outfitter since the hunt and I can't believe the guys is still sending NASTY threatening email back to the outfitter. Again I ask what is his motive? Illinois whitetail Services LLC is a blue collar worker camp and may not be for the guy like the one from VT to shot a easy one cuz getting to old. If that's the case go to the zoo and shot one. Might not be for the guy that wants eggs, bacon, sausages toast coffee served followed up by a hot lunch deliveried to him on stand and a dumb buck to walk in front of him. Dude that ain't hunting! Bottom line is you screwed up and didn't verify references or completely ask all the questions so that when you arrived in camp there would be no surprises and your expectation would have been real. Face DUDE this is just a personal attack on Doug and his business and towards anyone who has disagreed with you. Again if it was not the intent of you to do harm to his livelihood you simply could have posted a one line post. "Anyone thinking about booking a hunt with ILLINOIS WHITETAIL SERVICES LLC please call me or sent me a private message before you book". That is all it would of took and anyone that was interested you the. Could have told them you experience. But to do it the way you did was nothing short of a vindictive attack on a good man and a well run business for the blue collar deer hunter. Sorry steel candy I kind of started to harp on the guy who started this post while I was trying to explain some things to you. LOL bottom line is I believe it is a hack job by a person who can ever be happy or satisfied no matter how hard the outfitter works for him. I bet by the end of the 3 days he was close to being booted from the camp because all he was doing was{1}*****ing about everything |
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TLC
Posts:116
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| 04 Dec 2012 03:29 AM |
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have a feeling none of these guys praising doug doty expected this to happen. but, since I live 20 minutes from eldorado, and have heard of this place, decided to see what the locals think of the guy. bottom line, half said he was a jackoff, the other half said he was a good guy. so, not much there to help. but, for you that are defending this guy, why? can't he come and do it? seems you all want to come and jump on this guy for posting his opinion. seems like he has every right to do that. after all, aren't you all doing the same thing? his experience sucked. he has the right to tell people about it. just like you have the right to tell people about your good experiences. did the guy screw up and not ask questions? yep. but, from what I read in the original post, I would have expected more than what was given. been on guided hunts for bear in different states. not once did I have a guide or outfitter tell me to walk 80 yards, IN THE DARK, and I would find the stand. WTF is that? I was always brought to the stand the first time. then, it was my choice whether to go it alone or not. the outfitter screwed the pooch on that one. 80 yards in the dark. BRILLIANT!!! so, you can all keep bashing the guy if you want. but, seems to me anyways, that something is going on here for us not to be hearing from the outfitter on this. especially since you all are first time posters here.
and just for the record. think anyone who hires a guide in this part of the state, needs their heads examined. we have thousands of acres of national forest that you can hunt for FREE. with the same guarantee of getting something. ZIP!!!
and someone said that this guy hunts in multiple counties. besides going northeast on 145 towards carmi into white county, what other counties does he hunt? curious about this. |
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| www.everyday-hunter.com, LM NAHC, LM BuckMasters, Bears, Bucks, and Buffalo, ah yes, the good life |
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Bojack
Posts:8
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| 04 Dec 2012 05:36 AM |
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TLC@ weather I'm on a hunt with a outfitter or hunting my own properties I always get into the stand in the dark. That is what you do in order to the the wood settle down. I know for a fact if someone is concerned about walking in Doug has walked people in to the stands. Again just got to ask.
As far as our post towards the original poster what we say isnt taking food off the guys table unlike what he is trying to do to IWS.
What difference does it make how many counties he LEASES property in for his coustomers?
You have no statement of facts about IWS because you have no 1st hand knowledge of him or his business. Of course you will find people that don't like him and talk stufff about him. My guess they are in the outfitting business themselves and our in competition for business..
as far as Doug coming on and getting involved in this discussing that would be suicidal for business. He doesn't need to get in a peeing contest, how would that look not very professional. That fact that his operation has been written in top deer hunting magazines such aBUCK MASTERSRS and North American Whitetails gives creditability to him and his operations.
Bottom line responsibilitylity lies with the customer to check out the outfitter and ask questions so his expectations are real. This didn'tidnt do that and has no one to blame but himself. It's time for him to get over it and move on and stop sending nasty emails to IWS. The hunt is OVER
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smonteleone
Posts:6
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| 04 Dec 2012 08:55 AM |
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I don't need to have the last word, but in closing I would like all of Doug's loyal supporters to look on the wall of his living room. On the left, is a 173 inch 10 point buck that one of his neighbors shot at night and left under his tree stand. I wonder why someone would do such a thing. Could it be that they don't like him or his operation, I think that may be the case. They sure as hell don't like you or any other outsider intruding on their hunting grounds, and they dam sure don't like it when someone from out of town shoots "Their" bucks. As far as getting lost in the woods, It's never happened to me. I have hunted numerous wilderness areas both in Canada and the US. My sons also have hunted with me in those areas and they too have never been lost. If you can't use a compass and a map, I would not suggest hunting in those areas. As far as comparing Wyoming hunting to Illinois, that was not the comparison I was making. The comparison was the difference between an outfitter who knows what he is doing and one who just has a good line of BS. When a guide tells me that the bucks are locked down, a red light goes on. Big bucks don't get locked to anything except a does ass when the time is right. What he might better say to his clients is "the weather has been too warm, the rutting activity is taking place late at night after it cools off, I'm sorry but on this hunt, if it doesn't get cold i.e. below 32 degrees, and stays there for several days, you most likely won't see many big bucks". I have hunted these animals for 50 years, they don't like heat and they don't like wind and most of all they don't like being pressured by road hunters or ATV traffic.
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SteelCandy
Posts:232
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| 04 Dec 2012 09:27 AM |
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Bojack SteelCandy@ the reason we sit for 12+hours in a blind, tree stand is take advantage if the rutting activity and the deer movement that comes along with the rut. Deer can and do move all day long during the rut which give the hunter better odds of seeing deer at any time. And yes it is a challenge to say the least.
That is something I have never had to do. I have never had to wait more than a few hours, at most 3 or 4. Maybe I have just been lucky all of my life? The last few times I was in my stand before light and by 7:30 am deer down. I had always thought that scouting was essential and with the wide availability or game cams with time and date stamping it should help you set up with a little time for the woods to settle down but not 12 hours. Before I am even near the woods I know what I am looking for that day. It could be that scouting has shown the big buck I want arrives almost every day after noon so no need to be there at 5 am. Am I looking for meat and want a big bodied deer and do not care about the rack or am I after a trophy? Do I want to remove an older deer that has never had decent antlers so I can try to improve the local genetics? With advance scouting and aided by game cams I plan ahead of time. If it is not my local area and I am paying someone for their knowledge I would want them to be as well prepared. But I would ask many questions before plunking down $300 let alone $3000.
When I was very young I was told to never pass anything on the 1st day that you would take on the last and to never take anything on the last day that you would pass on the 1st. |
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jmprodrigues@yahoo.com
Posts:2
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| 04 Dec 2012 09:45 AM |
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To all of you gentlemen
The point is being missed here. Everyone has the right to have their own opinion and express it. I don't know Doug very well - just hunted there once and was very satisfied. This gentlemen was not happy with Doug's services and he has the right to express it.
However, that said he does not have the right to express it in the manner that he did; SCAM. He has accused Mr. Doty of operating a business in a fraudulent manner with the purpose to scheme. This was a personal attack on a man's reputation, his name. As sportsman we should not endorse such behavior; we know better and deserve better.
If he was unhappy with Mr. Doty's services, he should have stated so and give his reason or reasons - that is all. When you go further and accuse someone of being a fraud, you are going way too far over the line. Its nasty, mean, vendivict with only one intention, which is to ruin a man's reputation. ITS WRONG.
Everyone is entiteled to their opinion, but not entitled to intentionally destroy a man's name.
ONLY MY OPINION FOR WHAT ITS WORTH.
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antler519
Posts:4
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| 04 Dec 2012 10:03 AM |
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I have no problem with a guy expressing his opinion about his experience. The problem is that smonteleone chose to call Doug a "Scam artist." That's why guys are coming on to defend him. If you want to say you had a bad experience....fine. But when you make personal attacks, that's when the defenders come out.
And quite honestly, the more smonteleone posts, the more he shows he knows very little about Midwest whitetails and how to hunt them. When a buck locks down with a doe...neither deer moves very far for up to three days. They separate themselves and they sit tight. Unless that doe leads the buck into gun or bow range, you're sunk. And if a majority of the big bucks in the area are locked down, you're not going to see them. Every whitetail hunter with minimal experience knows that! That's Whitetails 101. Smonteleone was shown video of 2 big bucks on a farm where his one son hunted on Day 2. That video was shot the day before the season opened. The bucks were both locked with does and no one saw them during the hunt. That's what happens in lockdown.
Deer don't like wind? Is that a serious statement? Then why are there so many in Kansas and Iowa and Nebraska, etc., where the wind never stops? Smonteleone is taking his experience in New York and trying to apply it to the Midwest. It doesn't work. That 70-yard wide strip you mentioned where your stand is EXACTLY the type of place big bucks live in Illinois. It yielded a 180-inch, 300-pound buck in 2011. He turned his nose up at it, because he doesn't have the experience to know that's a SUPER spot in Illinois.
Again, the more smonteleone writes, the more he shows how little he knows about whitetails and about Midwest buck hunting. And he's taking his inexperience out on a guy who has forgotten more about hunting whitetails than he will ever know.... |
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Johnjne
Posts:4
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| 04 Dec 2012 10:25 AM |
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I would like to visit this alternate universe where hunters never get turned around in the woods, deer are dead on the ground by 7:30 every time out, and there is no lock down..
Are these posts for real??? |
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TLC
Posts:116
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| 04 Dec 2012 12:38 PM |
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Posted By Bojack on 04 Dec 2012 06:36 AM
TLC@ weather I'm on a hunt with a outfitter or hunting my own properties I always get into the stand in the dark. That is what you do in order to the the wood settle down. I know for a fact if someone is concerned about walking in Doug has walked people in to the stands. Again just got to ask.
As far as our post towards the original poster what we say isnt taking food off the guys table unlike what he is trying to do to IWS.
What difference does it make how many counties he LEASES property in for his coustomers?
You have no statement of facts about IWS because you have no 1st hand knowledge of him or his business. Of course you will find people that don't like him and talk stufff about him. My guess they are in the outfitting business themselves and our in competition for business..
as far as Doug coming on and getting involved in this discussing that would be suicidal for business. He doesn't need to get in a peeing contest, how would that look not very professional. That fact that his operation has been written in top deer hunting magazines such aBUCK MASTERSRS and North American Whitetails gives creditability to him and his operations.
Bottom line responsibilitylity lies with the customer to check out the outfitter and ask questions so his expectations are real. This didn'tidnt do that and has no one to blame but himself. It's time for him to get over it and move on and stop sending nasty emails to IWS. The hunt is OVER
bj, this is not twitter, so no need for the @ stuff. think that's where I saw that symbol used? anyways, no one said not to be in your stand before dark. said the outfitter screwed up by not taking the guy out the first time. I can walk to every stand on my place in the dark. but, have been hunting the farm for years. if I tried to tell anyone else, they may or may not be able to find the stands. I would take a first timer to the stand on a new property they had never been on. and if, as you say, you go in so the woods can settle down, it would be no problem to do this. and have never been on a hunt where the outfitter or one of his guides has not taken people out the first day. the other thing I noticed is no one talked about a night before sit down where the outfitter went over any rules, regulations, or safety procedures. again, never been on a hunt where this has not been the case. the outfitters took the time over the night before the hunt meal to go over the lay of the land, what to expect, what they had been seeing. all that informational stuff that would be helpful to a guy who had never been in the area before.
if I had the experience this guy had, would be saying the same thing. as I stated, the guy should have asked more questions than he did. then again, the outfitter should have supplied more information than he did. and, he has every right, whether you like it or not, to express his opinion(s). with no buts added.
you're right. what difference does it make? so why didn't you answer the question? curious if he has places in saline, gallatin, hardin, pope, etc. if you don't know, that's fine.
no. no first hand knowledge. that's why I asked people who have lived in this area longer than I have. and ZERO of them are outfitters. nice try on that one. but one is the police chief in eldorado. as I said, wanted to get independant opinions about the guy. and that's what I got. it is interesting though that none of you have done anything but hunt with this guy, but you are all saying what a great guy he is. how would you know that? or do you believe the attitude he has with people paying him money is the same attitude he has in the normal running of his life?
suicidal? wrong. we have had folks come on here and give bad reports before. the outfitter has come on and given his side. done deal. and it has a lot more weight to it than a bunch of people coming on and defending someone they consider a friend. almost seems set up. like someone is getting paid. at least, that's the way it is coming across to me. being in a magazine does not give credibility. but, since you brought it up, and I'm a life member with buckmasters, what issue was that in? month and year? can go thru and look up the write up about the operation.
"It's time for him to get over it and move on and stop sending nasty emails to IWS. The hunt is OVER"
best quote you have made in backing up my thought they you are either 1, the outfitter or 2, the outfitter is sending you here to defend him. how else would you know that the guy is sending the outfitter emails?
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Hollywood1027
Posts:9
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| 04 Dec 2012 03:31 PM |
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TLC,
As I mentioned in my earlier post, I have hunted with Mr. Doty @ IWS for six seasons. The properties that I am familiar with have been located in the following counties: White, Saline, Hardin, Gallatin, Hamilton & Pope. There may be more, but those are the ones that I can confirm with certainty. I'm not from Illinois, so maybe there are more, but I know for sure he has had hunters on properties in all of those counties when I have hunted there.
Also, I can't remember a single time I have been on a hunt with this particular outfitter where he didn't spend a good portion of the evening before the first day of the hunt confirming that everyone's guns were sighted in properly while it was still light, and then assembling all of the hunters and reviewing all of the rules, regulations, guidelines, insurance forms and expectations for the upcoming hunt. Mr. Doty is a very "communicative" sort, with no shortage of words, and definitely leaves no stone unturned as far as what he expects from each of his hunters. Often times I have heard him repeat the guidelines for each hunt over and over, trying to make sure each hunter was comfortable with what was going to take place the next day.
In conjunction with that, I think it's important to note that he has a designated folder for each property that contains the following information: - Detailed directions from camp to each property with every road marked including exact mileage on each stretch of road - Aerial photo of each property showing the entire property, with each entry point and literally the entire path to each stand clearly marked, as well as the stand itself. I am not making this up, as I have seen & reviewed the large stack of folders containing all of this information.
The paths are then marked from the entry point to each stand location with bright eye tacs for entry & exit while dark, as well as orange tape for during the daylight hours. This has always been my experience while hunting @ IWS. You seem like a curious fellow who's willing to make some effort to investigate the truth, so I wanted to relay to you my own personal experience with Mr. Doty. Obviously I can't speak for anyone else, but the things I have mentioned above are what I have personally experienced and witnessed.
I want to also assure you that Bojack is not the outfitter, nor has he even talked personally with the outfitter. I am aware of who Bojack is, and he's a normal client just like me.
Because of my multiple hunts with Mr. Doty, I have contacted him regarding this hunter's frustrations, and have discussed it in detail with him. I want to state that Mr. Doty has done his best to react to this unfortunate situation in a professional way. He recognized that, because of things outside of his control, this was a particularly hard hunt. I can assure you that there was no one as disappointed as he. As always, he would have been more than willing to work something out with these hunters, if there had been any interest on their end. Obviously, that wasn't the case. This man stated that he wouldn't even return and hunt there if a hunt was offered for free.
I recall one particularly difficult hunt, where a first time hunter from Florida was in camp and saw very little deer activity over the course of three days of hard hunting. Mr. Doty circled back with him at the end of the hunt and worked out an arrangement for him to come back and hunt again, in an effort to help this hunter find success. Well, needless to say, that was in 2008, and that particular hunter is now a regular in camp and has harvested numerous bucks over the past number of years that have all been some of his very best to date. I know that this is an accurate account of what happened, because I have become friends with the hunter I"m referencing and have hunted with him quite a few times.
I sincerely feel badly for smonteleone, as I have been there, when you spend a large amount of money on a hunt, only to come home empty handed. There are few things that can be as frustrating and even maddening. However, I just wish he had talked this over with Mr. Doty and tried to come up with an equitable arrangement to try to fulfill his expectations on a future hunt. I know that any of his concerns would have been listened to and addressed as much as possible, and that Mr. Doty would have done his utmost to try to ensure a very different ending to this story. He has chosen to take a very different path than that one, and it is one that I think was not a very productive option. He has every right to do whatever he feels to do, including relaying how upset he is over what happened on this hunt. However, that's where it should have stopped. Rant & rave, cuss & swear, relay your horrific story in detail, embellish every normal mishap on a hunt to the nth degree, and list your credentials and tell everyone this was the worst hunt of your aged life (all of which he has been doing), but don't cross the unspoken line and into the combative territory of calling Mr. Doty and his outfitting business a Scam and a Fraud. That is a poor decision on his part. I have zero problem with him saying anything he wants to about his hunting experience, but I do think it is inappropriate to publicly label the outfitter and his business a fraud based on a few days of hunting in poor conditions.
Hopefully that all makes sense to you and sheds a little more light on how business is conducted @ IWS. |
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antler519
Posts:4
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| 04 Dec 2012 03:51 PM |
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Smonteleone said the 70-yard wide strip of woods he was hunting, "held no big bucks." Well here are 2 bucks killed from that exact woods....the one where he got lost....The top one was shot in 2010, and the bottom one shot in 2011.
Nah....no big bucks in that woods....Smonteleone is an expert on that, remember?
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Hollywood1027
Posts:9
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| 04 Dec 2012 04:14 PM |
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Antler519, Thanks for posting those pictures! Those are nice deer! Although, even if smonteleone and his "boys" had shot both of those deer, IWS would probably still be considered a Scam and Fraud! Talk about a tough crowd... If I'm not mistaken, the tall tined 10 point was killed in the EXACT STAND that smonteleone was hunting in, and the massive buck was killed in the exact tree stand that he said no self respecting buck would dare approach because he'd be alerted to the "orange light bulb" in a tree stand 15 feet above the ground that was not "brushed" in or camouflaged! I actually hunted that stand in 2011 and, interestingly enough, I actually was able to put a safety harness around the tree. I'm not sure why he stated that wasn't possible. It definitely is possible, as I did it! P.S. Thanks for the wake-up call last year!  It's nice to know your fellow hunters are looking out for you! |
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Bojack
Posts:8
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| 04 Dec 2012 04:16 PM |
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Posted By TLC on 04 Dec 2012 01:38 PM
"It's time for him to get over it and move on and stop sending nasty emails to IWS. The hunt is OVER"
best quote you have made in backing up my thought they you are either 1, the outfitter or 2, the outfitter is sending you here to defend him. how else would you know that the guy is sending the outfitter emails? <p>
TLC @ Ha ha... Oh you are so wrong! I am not the outfitter and the outfitter did not send me here to defend him. I had been approached by a member of our group that hunts at IWS and he told me that he spoke with Doug last week to confirm receipt of our down payment for next years hunt and that Doug told him about the incident and how the hunter has posted on this website bashing him. Let me say this I am my own man and I am not lead around by anyone. No one had to tell me to come defend IWS as you claim. I did it becuase I believe it is a unfair personal attack on the man and his business.
Oh yeah Doug told our hunting member that the guy is sending him nasty and threatening emails thats how I know. Being a retired law enforcement officer if that is happeneng the guys is crazy for doing that because it could become a criminal depending on what is being said. But knowing IWS and Doug I know that is not in Doug's heart he truly is a good man
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Bojack
Posts:8
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| 04 Dec 2012 04:29 PM |
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now is the time for me to exit this discussion. There is nothing I can say that hasn't already been said. However, I ADAMANTLY disagree with the SCAM, FRAUD claim. IWS and Doug Doty are the complete opposite. They are as honest as they come and work hard at getting their clients a deer than any other outfitter i have hunted with. I just wish smonteleone did not chose to make it a personal attack on the man and his business. He has every right to express his displeasure with the outcome and expectation of his hunt but thats where it should have ended. I hope smonteleone moves on to bigger and better pastures and finds his dreaam hunt.
If its out there. |
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holly
Posts:2231
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| 04 Dec 2012 08:07 PM |
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You know I was going to stay out of this one as I know nothing about the state .I only have one question some of you defending this guy .Why dose he specify that you have to shoot a 140 class buck or pay a $500.00 extra fee if you do not .Is that only for newbies or for all .As all of you have said he has never charge you the fee .Or as I have asked is that only for newbies .From what I can see he never told them they could take anything that is satisfactory to them ,without the extra $500.00 .The guy could have been satisfied with that . |
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Hollywood1027
Posts:9
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| 04 Dec 2012 10:16 PM |
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Holly,
IWS has many different properties, and the outfitter in question has stated very clearly (to me at least) that there are certain, designated properties where the 140" minimum is maintained, with a $500 penalty for those who choose to ignore it.
On the other hand, I know of at least four different properties that he maintains where, for a whole variety of reasons, it isn't conducive to manage the herd in this fashion, so he doesn't enforce that standard on those properties, and allows hunters to hunt there who will be satisfied with a 125" class buck.
Also, that 140" minimum is a relatively new standard that he implemented in the very recent past, in an effort to continue to increase the quality of the deer herd for his clients.
I thought it was odd that the disgruntled hunter on this forum was "upset" that a few of the other hunters weren't "penalized" for shooting deer that were below the minimum. That alone raised a red flag for me. In the excitement of the moment, we all have shot deer that ended up being smaller than we had hoped for or anticipated when we pulled the trigger. For a fellow hunter to be upset that someone in that position received mercy instead of judgement is a little odd, to say the least. If it was a non-stop situation that would be one thing. But for a hunter to shoot a mid 130"s class deer on one of the properties, just a little below the minimum, and to not be penalized, is a good thing from my perspective, not something to be bashing the outfitter about.
I know that at least one of the bucks in question that didn't meet the "minimum" was shot on one of the properties I mentioned where the higher minimum isn't maintained.
Again, I have personally talked with this outfitter regarding this whole situation, and have gotten all of my information that I have posted on this forum "directly from the horses mouth".
Hopefully that answers your question. |
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SteelCandy
Posts:232
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| 04 Dec 2012 11:56 PM |
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Posted By Johnjne on 04 Dec 2012 11:25 AM
I would like to visit this alternate universe where hunters never get turned around in the woods, deer are dead on the ground by 7:30 every time out, and there is no lock down..
Are these posts for real???
I cannot speak for others, but as for myself I can honestly say that the last 2 years I did in fact enter the woods after 5am, set up in a predetermined area, spotted the buck I intended to take and then proceed to take said buck by 7:30 AM and was out of the woods and loading said buck in the vehicle by 8:30 am. The 3 years prior to that I was out of the woods by noon, but did not enter the woods until after 8 am. Neither I nor anyone else in the group managed to get lost. This is not to say that no one used 5 minutes to determine their bearings. Perhaps you consider pausing for a moment to scan your map as getting lost? This alternate universe is called being prepared and taking time to scout and communicate with every member of the group days ahead of the trip and making sure everyone was clear as to where each and every other would be hunting. Maybe some others are in areas with less deer or do not take the time to scout and plan out the hunt before hand, I do not know. But I do know that I would never go out blind with no idea of the area or animals in the area. As I stated before I am not rushing through the woods. I am taking my time and noticing anything that could be a landmark. Maybe some tree that was blown down and is leaning at an odd angle near the trail or an old fence line. Have a cell phone? Take a few pics as soon as the area looks unfamiliar, don't forget to take pics looking in the direction you will be traveling to come back. Use some trail markers and snap them on the path you are walking. Take a good compass and map ( study the map BEFORE you go ). Take a GPS. Still can't figure it out? Take an orienteering class before you head out. Do you bother to check prevailing wind currents the night before that are predicted for the next day? We do. Do you follow strict scent and sound control? We do. Do you go fishing? Take that time to scout out the terrain. Hell even google earth can help you get an idea of the area you will be in. If the only time you spend outdoors is the actual day you plan on hunting no wonder you get lost. If I can manage it anyone can manage it. And please stop insinuating that people are liars because they take the time and effort to have success and not get lost on the way. |
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Johnjne
Posts:4
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| 05 Dec 2012 05:56 AM |
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Just to make things clear, and to sign off because this is getting off topic, getting lost in the woods really has nothing to do with this thread. Of course I don't get lost in the woods, but to say you have never gotten lost in your hunting career is just silly. And congrats on shooting deer and having your plans work out the way you planned...but sometimes things don't work out as planned and you end up sitting all day, that's just hunting.
You're exactly correct, nothing can pay off better than great scouting, preparation, and proper stand placement, which is exactly why I hunt with Illinois Whitetail Services LLC. Doug has become a great friend and maybe that's why some of these posts defend him so adamantly. He's a great guy and runs a great outfit...no reason to keep repeating specific examples why.
Again, im sorry the guy that started this post had a bad time and it wasn't what he expected, I just think all of the accusations/bashing was off base and out of line
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MitchR
Posts:62
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| 06 Dec 2012 07:45 AM |
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After reading the responses in this thread I went back and read the original post again. I noticed this time that the he mentioned that he did pass on a buck he considered small. The poster was also upset about the actions of some local hunters in the vicintiy of where he and his sons were hunting, those actions may have been beyond the control of the outfitter. What I find interesting was his description of the food and accommodations, which seemed to be somewhat confirmed by the outfitters supporters with various comments. I would think at a $1000 a day it would not be unreasonable to expect some fairly nice accommodations and good meals. As a comparison I was thinking of a fishing trip I was on last month, for less than a $1000 a day I had a private cabin that was nicer than many hotels I have stayed, at the main lodge coffee was delivered to your room each morning, then you went to the mail lodge and ordered what you wanted for breakfast, for lunch we had soup that was heated by the guides along with a sandwich, there was an open bar for those that wished to have a cocktail before dinner. The dinners were unbelievable good and served with wine. I guess the bottom line, if you go on a hunt and have at least an opportunity then it is a good hunt, if you pass on that opportunity that is your choice, the elements beyond the outfitters control are just that beyond his control, but the accommodations and meals sounded very sub par for the amount of money tendered. I guess I don't consider this a "scam" but maybe somewhat pricey. |
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ternera1
Posts:333
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| 07 Dec 2012 05:18 PM |
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SteelC: when the first post showed up I read it and said to myself "they just got taken". Interesting to me that all the positive arguments are presented by "members with less than 10 posts? |
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| "You" showed us you were not prejudist the first time around. Now you showed us you are stupid and voted for him. Hello Idiocracy! N. Florida red neck |
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