Hunting Forum

I've been watching and noticed most ads and tv shows are for hunters with money, however the US fish and wildlife service tells us 70% of hunters hunt exclusively public land, 20% hunt both while only 10% hunt only private. What's this tell us? Most hunters are lower middle class. The IRS tells us the average American home makes 58k annually but that includes Soros, Gates and Buffet. The 'real' average is closer to 42k with the average hunter falling into this category. The census bureau tells us over 70% of Americans live in urban areas... Hunters follow similar but slighty more rural patterns. After seeing these numbers I realized that most hunters aren't using a heavily expendable income loaded budget. Thus there's a need for these hunters to have extra help, to find resources as they can't afford to experiment with things the way many of us do. nAHC hunters tend towards the more active and traveling hunters according to club stats. I've considered a blog named the budget hunter but am starting with this post.

First things first, firearms. You can get out the door, completely equipped to start hunting all north American game for $370. This will buy you a new savage edge/axis rifle with a scope and a box of federal blue box ammo. The scope is not great, but will work. I had an old package gun simmons I gave a friend who has had it on a 300 fo 6+ years and hunts, successfully, elk in Wyoming with it.

As for rifles, I put a 450 limit with scopes, marlin, mossberg and Remington (770) all fall into this category, on the rifle. These rifles vary a lot, mossberg and marlin both use accutrigger like triggers and so have the best triggers. The savage and rem both have removable magazines vs the blind mags in the previous 2. You'll have to decide what's important to you. For me, living in PA, where we must have the rifle empty before it touches a vehicle, the removable magazine is a big deal... I bought the savage.

Next is caliber, at this level there are no magnums, only short action and long action standard calibers. If you are just after deer, antelope or caribou, anything will work, however a number of states require a 270 minimum for elk and moose. In this level rifle this leaves the 270, 7mm-08, 308 and 30-06. All of these can carry a prerequisite 1500 ft/lbs of energy to 300 yds, the maximum 90% of hunters and most budget hunters, can take advantage of. One thing to note, if you ever want to hunt bison, some states have a 200 grain, 3000 ft/lbs minimum for... The 30-06 is the only member here who can hit that with factory ammo (Norma oryx, hsm). Thus. A 30-06 is the legal minimum for all na game, however apart from that any of those 4 calibers will get the job done at reasonable ranges.

Also on rifles, a NEF or Rossi can get you out the door under 300 if you look around. If you prefer wood, to hit the price point you'll need to buy used, which is not a bad idea.... On Rossi though, I'll show a marked preference for American products, so it would be my last choice.

Concerning gun choice.

When my boys began hunting and I needed a second deer rifle as well as a shot gun.  I chose the Mosberg 500A 12ga packaged with 2 barrels.  Standard shotgun and rifled with scope mount.  Adding the scope I spent about $400.00.  I do not hunt in the shotgun zone for deer. since most shots are less than 50 yards this packaged has worked well for 10 years.  The only real draw backs is the bruising recoil when checking the scope and the price for five 3" sabot loads.

-Mark

that's a great point mark. if you live east of the mississippi where most shots will be shortish (150 and less) and would also like to hunt waterfowl, turkey or upland game, a shotgun with multiple barrels can be a great investment. probably a better starting point than a rifle if you don't plan to hunt the west, and if recoils an issue, a 20 guage will take deer at 150 yds as well with modern ammo.

Think you have a good idea here, Gehee. A lot more realistic, keep it up...

For 'high end' inexpensive scopes, check out this comparison.

Www.Opticstalk.com/inexpensive-scope-comparison_topic21176.HTML

He does a real nice job on his comparison, my results are comparable to what he's seen except I never bothered with a barska.

I have a nikon, higher level, some older leupolds, a vortex and a bushnell. I really like the bushnell, it's optical quality is slightly lower, but it has rain guard which is nearly without compare in the field.

Btw, I call this " high end" because $200 would be the high end of what I'll review myself. Anything above that is not budget hunting

On scopes, you can often find higher end scopes used at gunshots for comparable prices to a 'good' budget scope. I purchased a nikon monarch for 150 used and can find some leupold products used for that too.

On the nikon, in my experience they have, for price range, remarkable optics, however they tend to be very finicky (my photography friends tell me this is true in photography as well) thus I consider them better range optics than hunting optics.

As for leupolds, in a myriad of tests they hold zero better than other brands, but to me have three major drawbacks.
1. Unless you buy used, their red field line is the only one in our price parameters.
2. Thet are not 'true magnification' scopes. Thus, a 3-9 leupold actually only is a 3.3-8.5 (from their own website) actual magnification. Other brands are a true 3-9.
3. As a result of 2, their field of view on low power (close shots) is smaller than competing brands.

I will be hunting a bushnell 3200 and vortex diamondback (on a savage edge) this season. I've hunted the bushnell for yearsand love it, but that rifle (savage model 10) got cut to fit the kids who will start to join me this year. Which brings up another important budget point... A gun you have is ALWAYS cheaper than one you must buy, even if it's not sexy,beautiful or new. Remember, on a budget, every cent counts. About the diamondback, another budgeter tip. A small local shop will often barter with you whereas a large chain will not, thus that diamondback, which was marked 190(just under the limit) actually cost me 110 mounted and boresighted. At the same shop, if you don't reload, she'll buy back my once fired brass.

Btw, how do you highlight links? The old site had hyperlink.

Im not sure if Im on the right track here, but your firearm would be the most important pc of hunting equipment, after all it seals the deal at the moment of truth...with that said, you would probably spend most of your budget on that to begin with, everything else is just luxury. fancy clothes optics and other gadjets. with the exception of license and tags..
A gun like an optima or triumph with extra barrels really covers all the bases without the expense of having to buy specific shotguns, rifles and blackpowders. one gun that does it all...even though the initial investment is a bit higher than $400 -$500. it ends up being budget minded to me. An whos to say you couldnt find one used for cheap that someone already took the hit on.

that's another really good idea. the combo guns like the CVA optima, the HR combo or Rossi combo allow you to get 2 or 3 firearms at once... and again buying used allows someone else to take the hit... as you mention, clothes can be worked with, red plaid was the 'camo of choice' for years, still works too, especially in areas that require orange, clothing doesn't matter as much. a quality scent killer spray will do what scentlok will for $8-14 instead of $200-600.

the warm shoepacks you use for shovelling snow can double as cold weather boots...

I don't hunt birds of any sort anymore, thus shotguns are only on the periphery of my consciousness. However, most hunters are not that way, a great budget option is an NEF pardner. I saw a clean used one in the store today for $89, full choke 12 gauge so it'd work for waterfowl and turkey. You can buy a Stevens pump, base model benelli nova, Remington 870 or mossberg 500 for cheap as well. But if you AaAre really on a tight budget a gun like that would work... Heck, if you wanted to hunt deer too, finding one of the nef or the Rossi with a modified choke (I don't believe you are supposed to shoot slugs from a full choke, someone correct me if I'm wrong) would also allow you a 75 yd slug gun for that $89.

I noticed that the swift 4x wide angle scope is only $75 and has a 36 ft field of view vs 29 for most 4x scopes and 33-35 as best for most 3-9 scopes. Figuring that a fixed power scope has similar glass quality to a double cost variable, this is probably similar optical quality to a $150 swift 3-9. wheelsIV, whom I haven't seen on here in a long time, used to compare swift optical quality to a vxII. I don't know but would like to try. If you need a low cost scope with decent glass and a good field of view for quick shots, this scope bears looking at. Remember, a fixed power scope can take a lot more abuse than a variable so if you must spend low, they're a much safer bet.

Posted By gehee on 10 Nov 2010 06:48 PM
Btw, how do you highlight links? The old site had hyperlink.

Gehee, the only way I have found is to copy/paste from the referenced site itself.

Keep up the good work here; really enjoying this thread.

Had the savage edge at the range with the vortex scope today. Managed 1.5" group inspire of the atrocious trigger (this thing desperately needs trigger work) notes on the scope... It doesn't have nearly as solid of a 'click' on the adjustments as my bushnell, but better than the older friction leupolds. Side by side it has an amazingly wide field of view vs the other scopes I own, even same power. It's very clear, especially for the price. It's crosshairs are thicker than my leupold or bushnell. This makes precise shooting more difficult but improves low light visibility....probably good for a hunting scope not a range scope.
The stock on the edge absorbed recoil remarkably well. With hornady superformance ammo and a factory recoil pad and being nearly 1.5 lbs lighter, it still had significantly lower recoil than the Winchester -06 with an aftermarket recoil pad on it(7-08)

But gees that trigger stunk. I'd pay an extra $50 for the rifle to have the accutrigger. No, it wouldn't be quite so 'budget', but that's close to what it'll cost me to get the trigger fixed and it still won't be as good as the accutrigger. Right now I'd be real tempted to go with the marlin xl7 inspire of the blind magazine, the savage trigger is just that bad thanks for the encouragement jj

on optics as im sure has been noted here a straight power scope from a name brand will be less expensive than a variable and have a better quality glass so you can in some instances get more scope for the money than you would with some brands

on the hunting firearm one gun that can really do it all: the mossberg 500
available barrels:
bird barrel
turkey specific barrels
rifled scope mount barrels
rifled rifle sight barrels
smoothe bore rifle sight barrels
security barrels
and even muzzleloader barrels

only thing is the muzzleloader barrel may not be legal depending on your states regulations

you could get the field/deer combo with the bird barrel and your choice of deer barrel (rifled/smoothebore scope mount/sights) and the muzzleloader barrel and be able to hunt anything on this continent providing you can get within range

another thing on optics is the mounts while they do not provide as consistant of zero hold as a true cantilever scope barrel the b-square and weaver mount has worked really well for me on my 870 i may not be exactly on zero but im always on paper when i go to sight-in also my $70 simmons 4x32 and $50 weaver side-saddle mount is a lot cheaper than that almost $300 cantilever fully rifled barrel at less than half that price

If you are looking for a cheap outfit, I noticed in kinsey's flyer they have savage edge packages for 299.99 right now, 3 short action and 2 long action variants, 4 of which fit our all a rounder criteria.

Www.kinseysoutdoors.com

They also have the mossberg 510 youth for 279.99 if you want to get a youngster out for birds... Stock is adjustable down to 10.5" v. 13.5 standard for full size rifles.

If one is talking "budget," why the discussion of new rifles? Until recently, virtually none of my rifles were new in the box, and all my hunting guns in the [many] impoverished student days were under $200, chiefly an old reliable Mauser Gewehr 98 of 1905 vintage in 8x57 that was semi-sporterized ugly but effective for $100 including a Weaver K4. It still throws 175Gr bullets at 2670fps into 2" groups and has killed deer out to 200 yds. Even now, my kids all have used rifles, chiefly Savage's and Remington's that were under $250 with usable scopes after they outgrew their SMLE's and Kar 98's.
To me, "budget" and "handloading" go together, just like "maximum mileage" and "stick shift" - fundamental skills that make caliber and the cost of ammo semi-irrelevant.
I've never been impressed by someone advertising how MUCH they paid for something, but have often sensed the satisfaction in how little one spent to achieve the same end. Though it is no longer a popular thought, frugality IS a virtue and I wish you well in your bargain hunting as well as the game fields.