Savvy:

  To understand or know; comprehend. (Second College Edition, The American Heritage Dictionary)

  I invite each of you savvy Elk hunters to share your knowledge here.  And all those seeking answers to your questions, ask them here!

  I'm not talkin about where to apply for your next tag, I'm talkin about huntin em.  Callin, stalking, glassin, getting around them, tracking, or out smarting them.  Water, feed, escape, migration, cover, camouflage, and scents.

I first hunted the elusive Wapiti with some guys I can still call friends in 1980, and have pusued them ever since.  I've hunted the Roosevelt, and the Rocky Mountain Elk.  I've observed their behavior, their talk, and the habitat that they inhabit.  And still, if I knew it all, my freezer would be full every winter - and it's not.  I know I have knowledge to share, and a lot to still learn.

Speak up if you have questions or the answers.

Thanks,

Dean

H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Thanks for this post.

Question: I have been told, and have done it, that you hunt elk up high. (Of course as you know up high out here in Washington is anywhere from 3500' to 6000'.) But I find that when hunting starts (archery, muzzle, modern rifle) that they tend to move down to lower elevations. Have you seen this or am I not going back in far enough away from everyone????

Hunt TED @ Mike Clouse

Here in Idaho the wolves have changed where you hunt elk.   They have changed their patterens.   At Elk City most of the elk are down around town rather than up high and away from civilization

                           Bill

Question: I've never hunted elk before but have an early season trip planned this fall in SW CO.  Any suggestions on camo(patterns, scent lock, insulated, whatever) I'll be bowhunting

if you don't mind if i ask a couple of. i hunt the southern oregon coast last year was my first year elk hunting. august is when it starts and over in september. ? is i'm not sure of what call to use cow, or bugle. i have been told don't bugle that time of the year. what is your input on that. ? #2 is it true that elk well only run down hill. i was told that is why you hunt from the bottom of the mountain and hunt up because the elk will runn down. is this true. ? #3 i have a late cow season in december and would like to no how going about getting a cow at that time of the year. thanks for any info you have    jeff
LOVE TO LIVE AND LIVE TO LOVE --- 2008 BEAR LIGHTSOUT --- QUAD ULTRA FALL AWAY REST --- TROPHY RIDGE 6 SHOOTER QUIVER --- TROPHY RIDGE STABILIZER --- JIM FLETCHER PEEP SIGHT --- CORRBON EXPRESS 300 --- SHUTTLE T-LOCK 100grn --- CHALLENGER SIGHT --- TRUE FIRE RELEASE

If you are hunting Sept.-early Oct., usually the rut, learn how to use a cow call. Bugling works to locate a bull but the cow call brings them closer. The only problem is every time you use your call you pinpoint your location so use it SPARINGLY.  It is better if you have someone with you, about fifty yards behind you blowing the call, to get the bull in bow range. They will hang up if they don't see an elk. I have learned, even though I am not very savvy, elk do what they want to do. You put yourself in the best position if you learn and practice as much as you can but luck still plays a role in elk hunting.
Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

Yep, and I don't know where you heard the downhill bit.  They will go up a steep mountainside or sidehill it  through heavy cover so fast that it's hard to believe, especially a bull with those big antlers.  They just tilt their head up to get that rack laid back and away they go!!!  
Topgun----30-06

I have heard them crashing through everything going up and down hill. But the one thing to watch out for when hunting the bottoms working up is the thermal air currents.
Hunt TED @ Mike Clouse

Hunt ted
Ta your questions:  yes, both
The elevation I hunted on the Washington coast was rarely over 3000 ft.  Higher than that an you were in the Park.  Pressure up high often times pushed em down.  Often we hunted high early, and hunted lower as the season progressed.  You have to hunt were the Elk are, if you're going to kill one.  Though if you can get higher, further in (than the other guys), the Elk will be there too.  Hunting Elk is real work, whether you hunt with those pushing em, or if make the extra effort to be further/higher than the others.  Elk will go were they are pressured the least, often that means hanging high (out of reach of most) till the snow pushes em down.

4dead
I've hunted Elk in WA, CO, ID, and WY.  I prefer to hunt them in the dark timber on the north and east facing slopes.  I wear a darker camo pattern than most, browns and grays.  I use a sent blocker, but think it's more important to stay down wind of them than what you wear or spray on ya.  I've found the weather in ID, CO, and WY to very unpredictable.  To be safe you have to pack everything, keep track of weather predictions and go into the field prepared.  (at noon yesterday here,  it was close to 50 degs.  At 5pm it was snowing hard.)  I'm at 6200 ft. here in WY, you can only guess what it was doing up at the 8,000 - 10,000 ft. that I'll be hunting Elk at this fall.  September and October can be the same, or worse.  Bring some camo tee shirts, and the warmest gear you got!  Be prepared!!!

oneshotlightsout
1) I think cow calling in any season works better than bugleing, BUT, it all depends on the situation.  I.E. other hunters in the area, peak of the rut, are the Elk spooked, is the bull close?  Every encounter is different and often calls for different tacticts.  As a rule; if I'm not hearing them bugle, and I know it's before/after the rut, I cow call.  If I know they should be rutting, and I'm in far enough that exspect to be clear of other hunters, I'l bugle and cow call to try and locate em.  Don't rule out bugling at night, I've located many bulls after midnight by calling, only to come back the next morning and get into them.
2) Running Elk, hum?
Elk will, like any other animal go what ever direction they need to for food, cover and escape.  Most times I've seen em running, it was up hill, and that was because I or someone else had spooked em.  When spooked I've seen them take a path that I was fearfull to follow.  You have to remember, the lead cow has probally been doing this for 18 or 20 years.  She's going take the herd up the steepest hill, down a creek, thru the tickest vegitaion, across the swiftest river, and down a embankment you can only stand at the top of and wonder HOW?
3) I hunt from the bottom up because of wind currents in the morrning and it's easyer to pack one out down hill.

Everyone Great Advice.  I agree with everything said.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Thanks Dean,

I'll be hunting the modern rifle in the Little Naches area just east of the passes. This would be in late October that the season opens. Would a cow call work best for bringing them close or would a bugle help? Not sure when the rut is in full swing or if when we are hunting this time if rut is over. I am looking to buy an elk call from Brian Warner of Heirloom Calls. I was thinking of get a cow and bugle calls. I do have the Hoochie Mama, so do I save my money?

You can PM me if you want on this second question.

Hunt TED @ Mike Clouse

Dean, I just walk around and wait for them to jump out in front of me and stop. Whatdayathink?

Actually, I walk alot. Still hunt when I can always knowing where others in my party are. I try to sneek up on them, but if I get busted hopefully I make another in my party successful.

I try to pick the areas where the elk will go when they feel pressure, the slightly harder pockets, and also I will go to the little stand of trees where you would never think an elk would be.

I know Dean has witnessed 30 elk hiding under a couple of trees. The most important rule for me is:

(Rule #1): Expect them where you least expect them.

I don't know how many times that I creep for hours through the thick timber, never seeing a thing, and just when I let my guard down and I start thinking this ridge is done, All heck breaks loose as the herd rips down the forest trying to get away from me. I kick myself and tell myself "Self, remember you are always hunting, hopefully there will be another chance tomorrow."

hello - I've hunted elk for the past 25 yrs here in arizona. It's a lottery\draw system ,so getting a tag is the most important part!

Here we worry more about the weather conditoins, believe it or not! Most of the elk hang out in the north /central area of the state!like a band from east to west. I think Knowing the elk habits is # 1 on the list -  Figuring out the bedding areas,travel route, feeding areas, is what  lets you" Pattern "the elk!

 All different types of tactics  work - stalking, still hunting. blind hunting . tree stands  etc. One of the most  important   is  WATER . It doesn't matter  where you are  at , or which state . The elk must water everyday! I usually sit a blind- that i make next to a water hole,tank, stream  etc. One of the most over looked place to find aand hunt elk is afence crossing. Most elk move when pressured , and eventually have to cross afence . Knowing these spots  can help  you fill a tag .

Elk will usually bed on a hill, any hill or mtn. will do . Here in arizona  we mostly find the bedding area  on the upper n/west slopes in the thickest timber.Findingthe trave lroutes  an setting up an ambush is a good tactic  here .  Elk trails  can be huge and wide. Watch which way they exit the meadows  and  follow the trails thru the woods.  and set-up   accordingly -  here  timing  is eveything too! -  more later -- Gary

hunt ted
I've heard em bugling all the way into early November.  Don't think I've ever gotten a reply from a Bugle past mid October.  The Hoochi Mama call is one of the most realistic call, that copies common sounds made by Elk, I've ever heard.  I carry one everytime out!  I also carry a couple of others, too.  One I like is, Carltons mouth cow call, you can vary the mews and squeals and make sounds that Elk make that the Hoochi Mama can't make.  Many diapham calls do the same, I just haven't been able to master them.  I carry two, three, sometimes four cow calls with me everytime I hunt.  Reason, I once was scouting a new drainage on Wahsingtons coast with a couple of budies.  I was packing two cow calls, and each of my buds carrying there own.  We heard a bunch of Elk chirping below us, and we each begain to use our calls.  We must have sounded like a whole herd of Elk above them.  We continued down the drainage, shooting to be at a truck we had parked below around dark.  Those Elk followed us down that hill for about four hours, talking to them occasionally and them chirping back.  I don't use all the calls I got with me, most calls are pretty lite and you never know when you'll want just one or want to sound like a whole herd.  I'll PM ya.

Skud
Right on buddy!  You are an Elk savy son of a gun, and I'll atest to that.  Jump in when ever you can, like I said above, I'm still leaning!!!  And you have helped me a bunch!  Thanks!!!

elkaholic93
Thanks
Don't stop now, you are on a roll.
I agree with water thing, though in the rain forest of Oregon or Washingtons coast I'd place alot less emphasis on it, which means everywhere else (where 98% of the Elk hunting is done) it's real important. I prefer the north and east facing slopes for that reason, more water.  Although, I've seen em move to the south and east facing slopes when migrating, pushed by weather or hunters, and for food.  Also agree with the bedding areas.  Good info, again Thanks!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Well hell,... evening there buds !

 

All I gotta' say is,.... ARE YOU READY ??? 

 

Can't wait to hit the hills with ya' this coming October!

 

Man are we gonna' kill us some wapiti !

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,..
. NAFC Life Member,...
. RMEF Life Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

To add to this some thing i have learned is dont shoot if you cant get them out.I have seen a few around that have spoiled before they came out of the bush.This is not a small deer this is a big animal so be prepared to work when it is down.One that I helped sortof on this year took five guys 12hrs to get out the meat was still good but the boys were darn tired.

If you are going to call elk be good at it.I spend hours playing with my calls it drives the wife nuts.I seen lots of people out there that cant call sorry not they cant they dont practise enough.There is lots of good sources out there for a person to listen to and try to copy.I even go down to some of the game farms to listen to them and try to repete it.

Here is more info on ELK and watering.

It does matter on what state you are in.

I believe Elk would prefer to water everyday, but Do Not Have To water everyday.

Based on the pressure and time of year, elk habits change.

In Western Wyoming, on Public Land, in the easily accessed area I hunt which has steep slopes, Pines, Aspens, Sage/Buffalo Grass openings, Streams in the bottoms with Willows. I use a couple of few terms to describe how the elk are reating to everything. I am only talking about a 50 mile area. Elk elsewhere in Wyoming would have different patterns and different ways to hunt them. The tactics would have to be tweaked. 

Early in the hunting season Elk where I hunt are usually in a "Summer Time Habit" I have watched them pretty much stay in a comfrtable bedding location usually darkr timber draw on a North Slope. They do water, but sometimes I have seen them water every evening, and sometimes they water in the morning. Sometimes I have seen them switch it up. Watering every evening, then for some reason they are there one morning and switch it up. I have watched them Graze-to-water. An hour before dark, I have heard them bust timber coming from their comfortable location, then walk out into the openings grazing to the water source. I believe this pattern is a good one if there is little pressure from hunters/motorized travel, If you are dealing with a herd of elk of a smaller size (3-a dozen or so elk). This pattern is dictated by the LEAD COW. I always see the most mature bull in this size group lagging behind the rest. Remember that there may not be a bull in the group, or he may not leave into the opening, he may water after dark. I have had two instances where guys I was hunting with were near small elk herds when they were moving through timber to go water. They let all the cows pass by waiting for the bull, and there was no bull. Have your mind made up if you would shoot a cow, shoot the first legal one offering a great shot. You may not have another opportunity. During this pattern, I also call these elk "resident elk" or those elk that have been right in this area all summer.

This is a pattern that I have seen at all times during the season, and into migration. I also believe Large herds move less. There must be someone in charge. I believe a large herd of over 20 or more animals causes the herd more confusion. I believe the larger herds move even less when not pressured and are usually bedded closer to food and water sources. When danger is sensed, I have seen large herds try and figure out which way to go. Searching for the elk in charge. While on an opposite ridge I watched a couple of hunters walk into a herd of about 250 animals. There only saw 4 elk and shot two spikes, but from the other ridge I watched 250 or more animals try and figure out what way to go. I saw thirty go one way, and fifty go the other, The herd eventually came together and almost single filed off the mountain and onto the other.

Hunting pressure really affects elk habits as does the weather. Hunting pressure moves elk from one place to another. If elk have Food, Water, and Shelter they stay put until something moves them. Hunters/4-wheelers move them. Early morning from daylight to 9, from 11 to 2PM and just before dark I find the best time to see elk running from hunters. If using hunting pressure to an advantage, be in an area where you would think elk would run into basing your choice on where the road hunters are running their quads, or the folks that don't go far from the road hunt. I get a little deeper in, and don't mind walking in the dark. I like the deeper canyonsa half mile in to a mile and a half. Use your topo maps to find these areas. Still hunt, and use your ears. If you hear shots, stop and listen every minute or so. The elk make a lot of noise and you can hear them coming from a long way. If I hunt an area early in the season and there were no elk sign, there may have been elk moved into that area an hour after I left or the next day, or never. Know where everyone else is hunting, know where the elk are eventually going to be in January. Elk where I hunt end up at feed grounds in the Winter. Some of the elk I hunt traverse 50-60 miles from where the Summer to where they Winter. These elk react to hunting pressure in a similar way as when the migrate to the feed ground. The time I mentioned above: Morning elk move under pressure because hunters are entering the woods, from 9-11 I see elk move because some hunters are leaving the woods, then entering again. Just befor dark hunters are leaving the woods again. I do not pattern when I enter or leave the woods based on my sleeping or eating habits. I decide the night before where I will be hunting, my plan, my tactic, the distance I want to cover, how many I am hunting with, and if the area offers opportunity to use hunting pressure around me. Elk do not water everyday when under hunting pressure. I have seen bulls by themselves not move for days. I have seen elk eat snow. I have seen elk running in the middle of the day from hunters cross a stream and not stop. I have seen them stop at a stream in the open to get a drink in the middle of the day after running from hunters.

Also, if you kick up a lone bull, and he trots off. Don't be reluctant to go after him, if the hunting pressure isn't too great, go look at his tracks, follow them see if he slows and starts meandering, if so he didn't go that far. I kicked up a bull one time and tracked him, saw him two more times but he was on to me. Figured out ehere he holed up. Went and got my dad, had him go to a location and how to get there skirting around the elks loaction, and told him to be ready. I worked my way back to the location and entered the pocket from the direction the elk would know danger would come and my dad killed that elk in self defense.

Late season, weather. The elk bunch up and are moving to the feed grounds. Us the terrain to determine where the elk will bunch up. Look for the deep canyon or steep slope that is between them and the feedground. This is where they will be until they get up the nerve to move.

There are many ways to hunt elk, and many different lacations and I believe that hunting them where I hunt them is different that hunting them In Arizona, Colorado, Utah, WA, MT, ND,PA etc...

There may be similar tactics that work in other areas. But everyplace is different and every elk herd has different patterns. That is why I enjoy talking about the way I hunt them in my small area and talking to others about how they hunt them.

Tom

hello - Just a little  note - ^ comments from last post  on the elk not knowing  which  way to go . I can't tell you  how many times, I've watched  elk traveling  from  water- to beds- to meadows  etc. Most of the time  the will travel single  file  , with  the  lead  cow  out  front and the bull bringing up the rear!  When  they approach  thier   destination  , they  will fan  out and   mill around  finding each looking for it's  own  spot - etc. 

My point is don't expect this to be the hard fact, especially when hunting! Countless times I've had them  file bye. Ok, here they come   - 1- 2- 3- 4   - oh  no  where is that cow going, shes headed ,angled my  way  -  noooo   busted! There  was only  2 more cows to go by and i'd had the bull - at  30 yrds. Not one of the others  knew I was around - It was a done deal, except for that one cow  had to decide she didn't want to follow the leader anymore - why, at that one  moment !   That's  hunting --Gary

nothing like hunting the willows at timberline during blackpowder

 

i really like the hootchie mama.......got me him <------.

theres a new call out by primos,called the IMAKADABULLCRAZY[i kid you not]and it gives you the raspy "uuggg" and the end of the mew.

 

LM since 1995,NRA,Sons of Confederate Veterans.Colorado Springs,Colorado.

7mm Magnum
I'm ready!!!  My camp will always be your camp!  Read everything above and below, a lot of Elk savvy presenting it's self here!!!  Skud, has specific info ta the area we'll be hunting if you draw and a lot of Elk savvy in general!  Hope ya draw the tag, and share another hunt with ya!   You've been there; share your stories about getting in shape, and hunting them ant hills. And share the Elk savvy you've learned!  Wapiti hunting, is nothing like hunting Whitetails, right?

fogbucker
Right on!!!!!!!
I hunt back in a ways, but you always have to keep in mind: How do I get the meat out of here?  Big animals!  I leave nothing behind , always packed mine out with the bone in.  I'm very interested in any info anyone has on boning one out!

Skud
Great info again!!!  Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!  Do believe everything said, applies to most everywhere you'd find Elk.  Man, I find myself reading every word anticipating that bull to magically appear!  I know for a fact, you get back off the roads, as do I.  Those of you reading, heed Skuds words!  They apply to most anywhere you hunt the elusive Wapiti!

elkaholic 93
I have seen the same!  But I have observed that when they bust out of the single file line, most often, it's because they are feeding.  They become less vocal, but still keep in touch with an occasional chirp, and they slow down.  Single file, I'm on the go - trying to catch up with em.  Spreading out, I slow down.  Faster than if I was hunting Whitetails, Blacktails, or sneaking up on a Mully.  But still slow enough that I can move quietly and catch up with em, figure out the direction they're traveling, and circle around em (down wind) and get a head of them.  Truly believe, being ahead of the the Elk is the key to bagging one.  Good info elkaholic 93!

obxman58
Nice bull in the avitar!  Tell us how ya got him an the savvy you used.

Thanks to everyone!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

For some other info try this link: http://www.elkcamp.com/ on elk hunting. I haven't been to the sight for a while, but does have some good general info. But nothing like this I'v been reading.

Thanks you all

Hunt TED @ Mike Clouse

Hey bud,...

As of 10:00am this morning,... I'll be sittin' around the firepit with you this October,...

 

I DREW MY TAG!!

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Life Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Great news Terry!!! Got off the phone with skud a bit ago, he told me you had drawn. YEE HAW!!!
I'll talk with ya soon!
Dean
H2O
Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Back on topic.
One thing I've notice hunting Elk, the big bulls are very often lighter in color than the rest of the herd.  When I get into a bunch of em, I always look for a lighter animal first, then check everyone I can get my bow pin or cross hairs on.  Also, the bulls tend to be toward the end of the herd when they're traveling.  Found it often makes for a dilemma.  You have to wait for cows, calves, and small bulls to file past you, sometimes to only find there are no big bulls with em and you passed your shot at putting meat in the fridge.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I have never had the best vision. Wore glasses since the 5th grade. I am right handed (shooting) but left eye dominant (my nickname should be lucky).

Anyway, for elk hunting I have adapted. When creeping around in the dark woods, I rely more on my nose and my ears.

I believe the stuff below is not news to successful elk hunters:

Remember elk smell. If you have never hunted them, the first time be aware of this fact. You can smell them for a distance. If something crashes the timber ahead of you but you don't see it - go to the area (from downwind) and you may have discovered that you just kicked up an elk, all by smell, even if you can't find the tracks right away. If elk have stayed in one location for awhile, their smell will be there for awhile also. After lots of experience you can tell what is fresh elk smell, and old elk smell. The best example is if there is melting snow or a slight thaw, and the melting snow is on elk crap, the smell starts to permeate. This would be old sign and to me it smells old, like a bitter barn smell. Fresh elk smells to me warmer and slightly stronger and more pungent. If you smell the stronger fresher smell, the elk are close or have just departed the area. I am always consciously aware of the smells in the woods. When I smell elk I always stop and scrutinize every tree, nook and cranny looking for that patch of fur. I am also listening for the dreaded thump, thump, crash, crash. etc.

 

An example that I can give also is this: I do not use cover scents - I have tried them, they do work. To me elk cover scent such as the cow piss, smells like elk, but to me it smells like old elk scent. Fresh elk scent to me is more pungent warmer (scense wise) and stronger. I have used cow cover scent in the past, just couldn't stand smelling like an elk back at camp. etc. Only put it on my boots, and the smell stays on the boots for a long time. The scent that I used more than once is anise extract. Smells like licorice. I believe this smell is natural in the Eastern United States, but not in the Rocky Mountains. I do not believe that it attracts elk, but the effect on Mule Deer was crazy. Mule Deer seemed to be interested in this scent, they would snort and run circles around me really just trying to find out what that scent was. I believe this scent attracts whitetails in the East. Muley's actually hung around while using Anise as a cover scent. I chose to use the wind in the direction I am going, wind at the back is what I stay away from, but you can also use wind at your back as an advantage. I try to keep the wind at my front, or quarter, and always keep an ear open towards the way the wind is blowing.

This is entriely different than glassing, and spot and stalk.

If glassing is not productive, go into the woods and listen, use your nose. The results may surprise you,

When I walk through the dark timber I take only a couple of steps then stop, listen, always smelling, and looking. scan at distance and close. Sometimes there will be an elk just standing there 10yards away that you didn't see. It is amazing that elk just materialize. Expect them when you least expect them.

Clothes - I am not a rich guy and can't afford some of the specialty items. I am slightly wary about Laundry detergents. I believe that elk and deer and other animals that don't see in color process UV light differently, there has been lots written on it. I wash my hunting clothes after the season without adding soap. There is enough residual soap in the washer. Any blood stains usually darken up over the years, and they look cool. Anyway, I do this because any brighteners degrade over time. The brighteners in laundry detergent reflect UV light so that your clothes look Bright to other humans. I believe that to an elk or deer, your clothes would look like a bright spot or definitely a lighter unatural spot to them.

There is laundry detergent especially to defeat this for hunters, I just have not purchased any.

YOUR FACE - If you have not won a Grizzly Adams look-a-like contest - Your face, unless you are dark complected is A BIG WHITE SPOT. If you are a duck hunter (or a bow hunter) you would understand. I don't use camo face paint, I do have some of those face camo pull over things but rarely use them. I try to avoid a direct blast of my face to an animal looking in my direction. I may be way off base, It may be because I am so ugly that a direct face look towards the animal scares them away.

Make all movements slowly, including raising your hands and moving your head. Quick movements scare them away if they are watching. Slow movements may keep them trying to figure out what you are.

 

Tom

Alright after reading the other posts I have a question.  Last fall I hunted deer in WY and while hunting through one area I found a whole lot of rubs on trees and then I came out to a small draw that was maybe 40 yards across and 100 yards long before it joined a creek.  This was approximately 1/4 to 1/2 mile from a road.  There were at least 2 different years worth of rubs on trees and a wallow.  I did not see any real sign of humans around there but if they were archery hunting their tracks would have been gone.  We hunted this area a couple different times and there were at least a set or 2 of new tracks on the road each morning. My Dad is 60 years old and had to go to a crossbow last fall b/c his shoulder no longer will allow him to pull a compound.  My question is if he hunts this area or any other area I would find with a hot wallow while I am hunting would he be better off hunting all day, mornings or evenings?  I am torn on trying a rifle hunt also with him but am concerned about his ability to make the hikes all day, everyday.  In WY crossbows are legal and I think this area looks good enough that if he hunted eastern whitetail style for several days I would hope he would get a chance. 

Any thoughts BTW this area is in the Medicine Bow NF and everywhere we hunted there were rubs.  The locals also told us that the herd seemed to be up last year so I am considering maybe buying a point this year and trying to draw a general tag next year.     

LawmanU27, NAHC LM, Formerly Hunteverything

Skud. Some good posts. I agree with everything you said.

The problem with cover scents is that they interfere with you own sense of smell which as you stated is a very useful sense.

 

You can purchase laundry soap at the grocery store that does not contain perfume or dyes for the same price as regular soap. Purex Free and Clear is one of the brands.

 

I  believe that if you don't move and they don't pick up your scent that deer and elk do not recognize you as a threat even if you are wearing blaze orange and are not behind cover.

BCrites- One good way to figure out the best time would be a trail cam. That will tell you when they're around and exactly what is around. If you're gonna do it whitetail style you might as well throw a camera in the mix. Personally I've never had good luck directly on a wallow. I've had shot opportunities, but it was early in my bowhunting career and I always seemed to give myself away. How I hate they sound of that "bark" followed by stomping hooves and cracking brush as I watch their tail ends trot away If you're huntung the rut though, rubs and wallows are always good spots to do some bugling or cow talkin'.

I have never seen an elk in a wallow, but that is because I am hunting rifle season. Usually there is water at or below that I have seen elk come into drink. H20 may have more useful info. By the time I am up there it has frosted or snowed a bit and wallowing seems like a distant memory.

I would imagine, if it is still hot - and there are bugs and you find a hot wallow - this would be a good spot. But the archers out there would have the good info.

jroode, thanks for the advice. I'll look around for that soap. And yes I forgot to mention that the scents have done just that, also if you have a cover scent on you you can figure out pretty quick if that wind is at your back, when there is a light breeze, cuz the smell will come around to the front of you.

 

It is amazing that an elk will stand there and look at you, while you are still. Mule Deer, I have noticed - will watch you pass by. If you never stop and look you will walk right past them.

Howdy there skud,.. looks like we'll probably be meeting each other in a few months,... 20 mule team borax is odorless laundry soap and there's also a formula out called "Scent Wash" which also helps eleminate the brightners left over from any previous washes. I like washing all my hunting gear and storing them in large plastic garbage bags with some cedar wood chips, or pine baughs and seal them. Makes for a natural cover scent that isn't too over powering.

 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Life Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Looking forward to the meet.

We have a pretty good camp. Last year was rough, there was too much snow to get the camp where we wanted, but we made do.

In my opinion the area is very beautiful. There are easy places to hunt to moderately rough. None are too hard as long as you take your time.

Dean knows a bunch of spots for only being up here two seasons. There are so many spots to choose from.

I will send you a PM. For some other stuff.

 

Tom

Thanks Tom,.. got your PM and sent back a reply.
. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Life Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Good stuff, thanks for sharing guys. I am planning my first elk hunt this fall. This is by far the most informative thread I have found on this BB. Great to have the insights from the guys with experience. Thanks! 
SFC, US ARMY(ACTIVE)/ LM NAHC/ LM NAFC/ MEMBER NRA/ - TAKE A KID HUNTING TODAY - THEY MAY TAKE YOU TOMORROW -

Great info guys!

I  agree with most everything!  One or two issues I have are with the 'easy to moderate' and the 'sneaking one foot at a time'.  Know I won't offend Skud by exasperating on these two.

Easy:  There is no easy Elk hunting IMO.  Every Elk I've taken has required real work, before the hunt, during, and after I pulled the trigger or let the arrow go.  Granted some Elk hunts are easier than others, and you can describe an Elk hunt, compared to another Elk hunt as easy or moderate, but I believe you can not be in to 'good' of shape to tackle these critters.  Recommend running steps, and working out, and even that may not help you with dealing with some of the altitudes you'll be dealing with.  But you will be better prepare for huntin the Wapiti.

'One step at a time', great idea when you know your close.  IE you can smell them, see em, spotted and stalked to cut them off, or on fresh (spread out) tracks, or in an area you just know is real Elky.  Rest of the time you'll need to be covering ground.  And I mean covering ground, as much area as you can.  Several was to do this; sitting on a point and glassing, driving around in a truck stopping periodically to glass, on horse back, bicycle, quad (fourwheeler), or on foot.  I prefer to use some motive of transportation to get me back in aways, and then spend the rest of the day on foot, stopping in the openings to glass and slowing down in those Elky areas in the dark timber to take a real good look around.  Rest of the time I'm covering ground fast (and ya better be in good shape to keep up), lookin for fresh sign (tracks, smell, droppings), that tells me I'm close enough to slow down.  In the same range that a Whitetail roams you can have 0 Elk, or maybe a herd of 250 with in a couple of hundred yards of each other.  You can spend a whole day covering a mountain and not see any.  You can go back a couple of days latter and tag a big bull laying in his bed, or jump a hundred, fifty yards from your boot tracks a couple of days ago!  Every step can bring you a shot, or get you busted!  But you have to cover a lot of ground if your even going to find them and have a chance at getting a shot.

BCRITES
I've never stand hunted Elk, but know from others I've hunted with that it works.  Elk will often water near the same place for a couple of days, bulls with often use the same wallow for a day or two if there is food and good cover for the rest of the herd nearby.  They often will cross roads or other obstacles in the same place. Often I have seen repeated rubs, year after year, in the same area.  I know that some Elk frequent certain places and often come back to them again and again.  Can’t say for sure if the place you’re speaking of is any of these.  But think if you’re seeing ‘fresh’ repeated use by Elk, it might be a good spot to set up on.  The key is ‘fresh’.  Elk may use an area for a couple of days and not be back there again for weeks or even a year or more.

 

Again GREAT INFO guys!  Keep it coming!

 

Dean

H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I agree that the way elk move around that you cannot cover too much territory.  As Dean stated, they may be in one spot for a day or two and won't be back for God knows how long.   One good thing is that if you can get to a vantage point where you can see well, sit there and really use the binos.  Elk are big animals and their coloration makes it much easier to spot them than deer, unless they are really in the dark timber.

Hey Dean:  Watch Terry closely.  I hear he is so into that wapiti hunting that he even tosses a few horse apples in that clothes bag to lessen the human scent factor  

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

Great info guys.

 

As far as how to pattern elk it depends on the area you will be hunting.  How much preasure they get during the season whether it is a migrating herd or not.  As said before each day is different.  One of the most important things is to scout during the off season towards the end of summer and into fall right before the season.  I have been out a few times already and the other day a herd of about 700 head are wintering on some private land out in the flats.  This is a high concentration.  Of course there are only about 10 small bulls there.  I know there is a herd of 20-40 bulls that don't hang with the cows right now.  I just haven't found them yet.  I will though.  The preasure during the season changes the elks movements high preasure means they seek relief.  Low preasure means they will continue with what they do. 

 

Feeding areas  south facing slopes seem to be the best here due to snow goes off them quicker and they are in the sun light for the early morning feeding.  Great spot to get into before daylight and wait for them to start feeding. 

Bedding areas  cows will usually be scatered throughtout thick pockets of timber away from "felt" danger.  Bulls will be scatered throughout the cows but bigger bulls tend to hang towards the tops of ridges or nearest to the quickest exit.  (bulls will go straight up to get away from danger 90% of the time whereas cows will use trails more often)  When the bulls aren't with the herds the big ones are in the deepest thickest hardest terrain you can find.

Trails  hard to determine what path the elk will take on which day but if you find that one trail they use most often then you up your odds.  Usually ones that offer the most cover are the best choices.  Or where 2 trails become one.  Once they commit to going they go and go fast so be ready.  Even walking they can cover ground like no tomorrow.

Calls I don't use a bugle I use about 5 different cow talks I will cow talk a few mews while I hike.  Have talked elk in from up to 1000 yards away.  Like shooting this takes practice and lots of it.  If you are going to get a new call for this year get it now and practice.  Don't wait till the last minute to buy one.  Give yourself some time to perfect it.  The best way is to record a series of calls and then record a series of your calls and compare the 2.  Remember no 2 elk sound the same you need to sound like an elk but you don't have to sound exactly the same.  Don't just sit and call calll call if you ever hear elk talk they mew then listen so give your series and listen for a bit.  When big bulls come in they don't make a sound (I know it is hard to beleve but it is true)

 

Hope some of this helps.

 

 

 

 

OTSS, Disclaimer-All views and opinions in this post are of my own and not subject for change as I can think what I want when I want and will not be held acountable for the pissing and moaning brought on by reading said words. G&M Wild Game Processing, Helena, MT "You Guttem We Cuttem" Mike R. Life Member Since 2001

I don't know if I can add much, I think the elk are more savvy of me than I am of them.

 

Elk do seem to have a pattern to there movements but that pattern changes with the seasons and the pattern isn't a daily pattern but more like a loose monthly pattern.  I know an old lady who has been living in the same house in the foothills of the Cascades for longer than I have been alive. She has a herd of elk that frequent her pasture. She says they will spend a few days to a week around her pasture then dissapear for a couple of weeks to a month then they are back. They have been doing this forever so it is definitely a pattern but not one you can rely on if you have only a week or so to hunt.

 

So my advice is to spend as much time as possible year round looking for elk, remembering where you see them and realize that they will be back there again. When hunting season roles around go from one of these places to another until you find them. Don't wait for them to come and find you. Like Dean I do not hunt from a stand. Mostly because I am too antsy to sit still for more than 15 minutes. But a stand can work if you have found the elk and can get between their bedding area and their feeding or watering area. I hunt mostly with my ears. Elk are noisy. They are big so they make noise when they move and they are very social so they talk to each other continuously. So more often than not you will hear them before you see them. I don't bugle. Unless you are some kind of expert, I am not,  more often than not bugling just tells the elk where you are. You may not scare them off but it is hard to approach an elk once you have announced your presence.

 

 I am strictly a bow hunter when it comes to elk and getting close to elk when there is always a dozen or more pairs of eyes and a dozen or more noses there to detect you is tough. When they do detect you they seem to explode and dissapear in a cloud of dust. When this happens the tendency is to say "dammit I blew it" and go looking for another herd. But that may be the wrong thing to do. Even though they look like they won't stop running until they reach the next county that is rarely the case. The calm down quickly and can be approached again and again. The trick is though, not to follow them. They always watch their backs and will see you coming every time. Learn the area and where the elk are likely to go once spooked and take off as fast as you can without hurting yourself and try to circle around and get ahead of them for an ambush. Sometimes you may spook them again but just keep trying until you wear out or get one. Some of my favorite memories of hunting are of days spent playing this cat and mouse game.

Big Lance

"obxman58
Nice bull in the avitar!  Tell us how ya got him an the savvy you used."

"When big bulls come in they don't make a sound (I know it is hard to beleve but it is true)"

 

opening day of blackpowder 3 years ago.myself,D W Poole,another lifer Marc Martin and my son madeup our party.

my son and me had done 6 miles fromcamp[according to gps]and the only elk we had seen was a lone cow that busted us in a logging road.pretty cool because the cow barked at us,and Austin had never heard one bark.other than that,no bugle-ing.....nothing.

after lunch,both of us went over to an area where i had killed a raghorn.  it was 1400 and unfortunately,my son decided he wanted to nap in the truck[it was awfully warm]and i tried to convince him to nap in the woods.too bad as it was the first year he wasold enough to carry a gun,and he could have killed this bull.

the logging road was only a mile and 1/2 and then dead ended.i love to still hunt and just leisurely walked down the road,trying to stay in the shade.i had a hootcie mama and several diaphrams,along with a grunt tube.i had only been chirping on a diaphram and hitting the hootchie mama when i was stopped dead in my tracks by what sounded like a bugle back from where i had just came.

i cow called a few more times and din't hear anything so i hit a big scream on the grunt tube and was instantly answered by a bugle which i could barely hear.so i started cow calling and then every few minutes would toss in a bugle.he would answer every time i bugled and i honestly thought it was another hunter......then nothing!all of a sudden i saw his rack bobbing and weaving through the trees.he had covered a good piece of land and almost busted me,so i do believe he was trying to sneek in.i literally sat down on the edge of the logging road because he got there so quick,and all i could see was his rack,neck and upper chest looking in my direction.i already had the smokepole up and resting on my knee,but he just stood there staring in my direction for what seemed like an eternity,so I slowly squeezed out another chirp on the hootchie and then just like it was scripted,he walked out in the road and stood broadside at 38 paces.

just after the smoke cleared,i heard another bull bugle from behind me,and equally as far away.I found mine 40 yards down in the woods.sweet......love it when theres a short drag to the truck!

so,my thoughts are,hunt all day,especially during the rut.and just like turkey hunting,when you think they are close,put the call down,or at least muffle the call to make the bull think he still has a ways to go and might not be "on guard".i have also heard that the lead cow will come investigate an un-welcome cow call as competition?

 

 

 

 

LM since 1995,NRA,Sons of Confederate Veterans.Colorado Springs,Colorado.

Awesome obxman - Great story.

 

Geez dean, what I meant to say was the terrain is easy to moderate. Easy where you was hunting, hard where I was hunting

It actually was flat where we pulled the bull out - that was easy (terrain) but I know we both have seen the rough stuff up there.

I hate it when the terrain eats your boots and you leave the woods barefoot.

 

Tom

 

that brings me to boots.

Good quality boots. Don't wear hiking boots so I don't sprain my ankle. Lots of Rock and steep slopes where I hunt.

I buy not the most expensive boots, but I do look for at least solid construction, full grain leather on the leather parts. And I prefer a harder sole so I can get an average of between 2-3 years out of them. I think I get more use out of the boots because I always have at least 2 pairs of boots to hunt in. I also have another pair of cheapy boots to change into at camp.

I change boots daily, nothing like starting the next morning in boots you sweated in the day before when it is 10 degrees in the morning. Cold feet.

So when I add a new pair, I wear them for at least a couple of weeks before hunting season to break them in. I have had people show up with new boots and be miserable with blisters after a couple of days.

I walk a lot, so I don't like too much insulation, I usually get boots with 800 gram thinsulate. I think the amount of insulation has to be a personal choice based on how much you walk and how sensitive you are to the cold.

I usually wear two pairs of socks, One just regular tube socks, and a pair of insulated socks over them. I believe this also helps in defeating blisters, as this as standard way to do things when I was in the Navy, on my feet all day in the most comforatble clod hoppers you could ever imagine.

Whatever socks you choose, make sure you have them when you are buying your boots, wear them when you are trying the boots on. Make sure that you can tighten the boots up. Too loose and you may get blisters. The boots may give a little as they break in.

Tom 

Thanks for the replys to my post guys. 

H2O--Is it feasible to actually ride a mountain bike out there?  I have found only 1 trail, rails to trail, that I think I could ride a bike on.  I have thought about using a bike but I am also looking at a map of the area I have hunted to see if this trail goes anywhere where there is little to no access by roads.  Also am I off base when I look at a map and try and find the most roadless area to hunt?  I would think this would be a good area just because I would have to put effort into getting in and getting an animal out. 
 
After my last trip and first DIY out west I learned a lot and will be in the process of upgrading some different gear and staying in shape.  I was in the best shape so far for my hunts out west and I felt and the end of the day I could have still hiked more and pushed harder. 

Looks like good info posted so far.

Brian 

LawmanU27, NAHC LM, Formerly Hunteverything

just be carefull in the wilderness areas.......no bicycles or mechanized vehicles allowed.

 

 

LM since 1995,NRA,Sons of Confederate Veterans.Colorado Springs,Colorado.

I hope this thread doesn't get into a wilderness area discussion but I didn't know that you couldn't have a bike - but that is the rule in Bridger wilderness. I also learned that hang gliders are out of the question.

Dean "NO HANG-Gliding ALLOWED"

 

Here are some rules for Bridger Wilderness - even though we don't hunt there:

The purpose of these regulations is to assure protection and quality of the wilderness resources as well as the safety of the wilderness visitor. Violation of regulations is punishable by fine and/or imprisonment. The following acts ate PROHIBITED within the Bridger Wilderness:

• Possessing or using a motor vehicle or motorized equipment such as a chainsaw.
• Possessing or using a hang-glider or bicycle.
• Use of aircraft without written permission.
• Camping within 200 feet of a trail or lakeshore.
• Open campfires within the seven special management areas.
• Horse grazing within 200 feet of lakes.
• Placing or maintaining a cache in the wilderness.
• Cutting or otherwise damaging any live tree or other vegetation without a permit.
• Staying in one campsite for more than 16 days. Visitors who vacate a campsite after 16 days may not return to the same site for at least 5 days.

Ok,.. now that I have some time to myself I can try and contribute some info to this thread. Elk hunting is defiantly NOT whitetail hunting. Lot's of moving and not much setting in on specific area,.. not unless you spot some elk then you have to figure your way to them. I like to go to different areas and glass around first. you can't hunt em' if they aren't there to hunt.

 

(now where have I heard that before?) 

 

I've been pretty much a whitetail hunter up until the past 10 years or so. My first elk hunt was in Montana in 1996 in the Beartooth region,.. beautiful country Montana! It was through a outfitter  of the name of Otter Creek if I recall the name correctly, horse packed in, a family run business, good folk, and would do whatever necessary to put you on elk.

My luck however we found some herds that wouldn't cooperate very much and was always one step ahead of us. But I had a great time with great people and was out doin' it every day. No guarantees elk huntin' folks.

 

In 2005 I teamed up with good ol' Dean,.. another savvy hunter in the ways of wapiti hunting. This was a DIY hunt in Idaho, driving around, stopping to spot around with  binoculars and spotting scopes, and miles and miles of walking! We did spot a few on the side of a hill across the ways from us and proceeded to get on them. They were gone by the time we got to where we thought they would be but picked up their trail and on foot we went.

 

Now the one thing I really want to stress, especially for all of us flat-landers out there is to get  yourself in the best condition you can. Climbing up and down drainages is not your everyday back home style of hunting and it will wear you out quick. The best suggestion that I had received was to run up and down stairs, or bleachers.

 

( I prefer the bleachers myself )

 

You need to work those specific muscle groups and build up your cardio system as well. When I was in Montana the majority of the time the horses were doing that aspect of the work until something was spotted and then you dismounted and went on foot the rest of the way. BUT with no horses,... and your the one doing it all day,.. day in and day out and it will wear on you. For my trip back out to Idaho in 2007,  I was better prepared as I knew what was to be expected. This year I'll be in even higher altitudes in Wyoming,.. thinner air will also come into play along with the ups and downs. There's not a whole lot one can do with the less air situation unless your toting along some bottled oxygen (not) so I imagine I'll have to pace myself and listen to whatever my body is telling me to do,.. or not do.

 

I also remember another time in 2005 with Dean where we jumped a spike from its bed directly above us as we were walking a logging road. Dean spotted it first and was off like a lightning bolt. I barely knew what was happening as it happened so fast. I started running up the hill in the direction Dean ran off to. Once I had made a bend at the top of the road there was Dean , rifle was leveled out and  he asked me "do you want him?" I looked up and about 50 yards up the hill side stood the spike just staring at Dean. I thought about it and said to myself what the hell.. But when I raised my 7 mag up and looked thru the scope the scope picture went from the kill zone and then to the ass end and back to the kill zone. After what seemed to be forever of trying to hold on the sweet spot I lowered my rifle and told Dean to take him.  I was too much out of breath to hold effectively on that spike horn. Now seeing that this was our 2nd or 3rd day out hunting,  out of a 14 day hunt and a spike was something that neither Dean or I were really after. We passed on him,.. I didn't want to make an unethical shot just for the reason I couldn't hold steady, and Dean really wasn't looking to burn his tag on a spike horn either. That elk would never know just how lucky he was as Dean could have had him in a heart beat,. he was like a stone with the bead laid right on him.

 

Remember get in shape,... and practice for those brief spur of the moment shots that just might present themselves to you. Practice alot puttin' that rifle of yours up to the shooting position in a hurry and holding steady.

 

It's not anything like those whitetail hunts where you can take your time to zero up and shoot. Sure you might be able to at times when your far enough away to spot them and take the shot. But from what I've seen and experienced so far while elk hunting,.. those opportunities are far and few between. I also have another issue I'll need to deal with as I fractured 3 ribs last summer and they still haven't mended up all the way. I'm praying that when this October rolls around it won't be an issue anymore. The doctor told me that  they may never heal 100%,.. but I'll cross that bridge when I get to it.

 

Look out Wapiti,.. October here I come !

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

7mm - I heard that story at elk camp!

Will be good to have you up here this year.

I almost hit the wall myself around day 4, but the body does rebound. Back when my dad was younger, he would ask me - Where you want to hunt tomorrow? I would answer - "someplace FLAT". Now my son asks me the same thing.

As I have gotten more comfortable with the elk herd, I am always hunting further, farther, deeper than before. But I am starting to feel the effects, especially after I get one down. I guess it is inevitable.

As for being in shape, absolutely. The more in-shape the more enjoyable the whole experience will be.

 

Yep Tom,.. the man is FAST,..his experience huntin' these critters has helped me out beyond anything I have ever read in any books about em'. The man taught me ALOT in those couple of weeks out with him.

 

The last 3-4 days in camp we were the only ones left out there as the rest of the guys packed it in. I wound up getting ill the last day or two there and left a day before I really wanted to. Seeing we were out there for all that time we decided  it was time to take a shower. We had one about 5 days before hand up at Rays place when we made a water run for camp. I'm pretty sure I came down with the flu after the one I took in camp. Had the "hot and colds" the next day pretty bad. It made for a very long uncomfortable drive back to Michigan but I made it.

 

Can't wait to sit fireside once again and hear everyone's huntin' stories and get to finally meet you also. Dean talks highly of you to boot!

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

On an additional note,.. the Wyoming Fish & Game must release the drawings winners names and addresses to all the Wyoming state outfitters as I've been receiving LOT's of invitations to engage various outfitter services in my snail mail lately,...

 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Same thing here Terry, and yes, the records with the names and addresses of all applicants in the Wyoming draw are on public record for anyone to get at free of charge as far as I know.  Good luck at what sounds like what will be one neat elk camp!!!
Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

Dang, now that's what I call some Elk Savvy!!!  Good on ya guys!

Topgun
After hunt'n a couple of weeks with him, an only two showers don't think anything he can put in his pockets this time out will make a difference!  Good info buddy!

mtmoose
Thanks for the input!  Good info!!!  Keep it coming!

Lance
You old wapiti wise son-of a -gun (opps! Sorry, you’d had to be a son-of a- bow), real glad to see you add your knowledge here.  It was a real pleasure to meet you and share the campfire last spring at the Washington NAHC Get Together!  You are one Wapiti savvy bow hunter, there's alot I can learn from you.  Don't stop now, I'm listening!

obxman58
Thank you for sharing that hunt!  Good info on the ways of the wapiti.  Know that Danny is a real hunter and one that I respect, you guys get to Wyoming and I'll have a campfire waitin.

Tom (Skud)
You know buddy, I wasn't raggin on you!  Just expanding on what you said.  With the exception of one that doesn't post here anymore that help me find work out here, you Sir (opps again, never call a Chief, Sir)(my bad!!!) have helped me more than anyone I've met in Wyoming.  You have showed me the crossings, sent me gps locations of all elk killed by anyone in your camp, described and showed me their migration patterns, toured me thru the area and shared how the hunting pressure effect em in the area, shared some dark timber hunts and your camp.  You are the reason I first join the NAHC.  Imagine that, almost 30 years in the Club and, you're the reason I first signed up.  Go figure?  Keep it coming Tom, you've got more Elk savvy to share here!  Thanks, big time!!!

BCRITES
I have a mountain bike with fin grips on the handle bars to hold my rifle or bow in place while biking into areas.  Many areas (outside wilderness areas) that hold Elk have been gated (no motorize travel.)  Many of these are fairly flat roads or trails that can be biked in fairly easily.  Over the years I've hunted the elusive wapiti, I've noted that they prefer flat ground.  Now, flat, is a description and relative.  On a topo map, it's where the lines are further apart.  You can almost hold up a topo map of any area that holds Elk and find them where the lines are furthest apart.  Though not always a rule, as others here have stated, Elk will go where they are least pressured.  I think they seek out the steeper slopes to avoid that pressure, but don’t stay there long (a couple of days).  When in further than most, by what ever means you get there, Elk tend to be where the lines are furthest apart.  A bike can be just one way of getting there!

 

Terry (7MM Mag)

I too remember that day in Idaho when we jumped that spike.  I almost killed him.  Instinct had me pulling the trigger, when it wasn't meat I was after on that hunt.  I remember cow calling to him to keep him in range, until we decided it was too early in the hunt to fill either of our tags with a spike.  I remember asking you if you were sure and saying "this might be the only opportunity either of us gets to fill" that tag.  We both passed on that shot, and we both went home with empty coolers.  That's the way of hunting Elk!  You may only get one opportunity.  It's a spit second decision.  We learn from those encounters.  I learned from that encounter, spikes are dumb, a cow call can keep em around long enough to decide if you want meat in the fridge early in the season.  Or, do you pass for the chance for horns on the wall later?  Elk hunting is so much about decisions.  Which drainage do I go up?  I see Elk, do I move in for a better shot?  Do I bugle, or cow call?  Every time out we learn something and we put it in our day packs for the next time out. If I'd have known that  was going to be the only legal elk our crosshairs would have encounter during that hunt, your coolers would have went home full!  Hindsight.  It was early, we were seeing Elk regularly.  I was hoping for something bigger as were you.  Guess that's why they call it hunting?  Looking forward ta doing it again, know we'll have at least as much fun as last time!

 

To All

Can't reply to everything posted here any more, too many savvy Elk hunters adding what they know (a good thing.)  If a question is asked to me, or I have info to add, I'll post it.  Would really like to keep this post on topic.  Speel your Elk savvy!  Post what you know about huntin the Monarch of the Mountains.  Conversations between friends can be done in a PM or email, phone call.  A lot of really good info is coming out here, from hunters that know what they're doing when it comes to hunting Elk.  Let's keep it flowing!  Those of you that are new or old to wapiti whacking, ask your questions.  I have met many that have posted here, and know they are wapiti wise.  Read the post of those I have not met, and know by reading their words that they know what they are talking about.  I have still much to learn, and I know others here do too.  Please keep it coming!!!

 

Question:

I try to hunt back in further than most.  I've always packed my meat out on a pack frame, never boned one out.  Had a butcher cut it up, and got it back in packages all labeled and such.  Any info, anyone can give me on boning out an Elk would surely be appreciated.  How do you keep it separated so when you cut it up, you know what's sirloin, what's round steaks (I know round comes from the hams), what needs to ground as burger.  Wife likes it in the package all labeled.  Packing the bone out when your way back in doesn't make sense to me.  Just the only way I've done it.  Has got to be an easier way!

 

Dean

H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Hey Dean,.. I can tell you how I've done it for pretty much all my whitetails for the last 40 years. As long as you pretty much know what your planning on getting from your critter and what areas of the animal produce which cuts you've pretty much got it made. I normally process my kill at the house in my shop out in the barn.

 

But there have been times up in the UP of Michigan where I have deboned out in the field. I purchase 1 gallon zipper freezer bags and after cutting the meat from the

bone all the meat goes into those for further processing when I do get it home.

Just follow your normal meat handleing routines by keeping it as clean as possible,

and then cold as possible. I try not to freeze my meat unless it is totally processed the way I want it. IE: Steaks, chops, roasts. The meat for burger and such can get frozen as it normally grinds better in the semi frozen state anyhow.

 

I always debone when I process,.. I don't want any of that waxey marrow and tiny

bone chips from a band saw on any of my meat (nasty stuff) and in my opinion taints the meat.

 

You just cut all the way through the meat to the bone (on the inside) the complete length of the bone of the removed quarters, and then roll the meat back away from the bone, while using the knife tip against the bone to "fillet" the meat away until the meat breaks free of the bone itself.

Put the boneless meat in the freezer bag,... toss the bones aside. You can use a sharpie or magic marker to lable the bags for processing later.

 

Big game animals are normally butchered into 6 Major sections:

1. Two Front Shoulders - ground burger, ground jerky, or roast.
2. Two Loins or Backstraps - tender steaks, butterfly steaks.
3. Two Hind Quarters - steaks, prime roasts, or hams.
4. Two Inside Tenderloins - most tender steak but small.
5. Neck Meat - ground burger, ground jerky, or sausage.
6. Ribs - Use as ribs or debone for burger or sausage.

 

 

Once you've actually done it you'll kick yourself for not attempting it earlier. It makes packing an animal out so much nicer. No real reason to lug all the extra weight of those bones out now is there??

I guess I'll have to show you this fall,....

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

The Colorado DOW has a tape on deboning.

You can find it through their websight.

http://wildlife.state.co.us/

 

 

 

I think Terry gave a very quick, easy description of how to do it and it's exactly like I have been doing the last two years on deer and antelope in Wyoming.  Elk are done the same way, with the only difference being that they are a lot bigger critters and take a lot more packing out because of the weight involved.  I never leave a bone in any meat I process for exactly the reasons Terry stated!
Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

Snow -

 

Completely changes the dynamic of elk hunting.

My tactics change.

If you are familiar with the area - use your travel time on logging roads to find tracks. If there are lots of roads, you can quickly figure out what section of the mountain that the elk are. set up the next hunt down trail from where you saw the tracks. Try and head them off - figure out which way they are going. Elk hunting in snow makes it much easier to locate the elk and determine their movements.

I always get excited when there is new snow on the ground.

Always check the tracks to make sure they are fresh - touch the tracks. If they are frozen they are not new. You can figure out if they are fresh pretty quickly. Knowing where the elk were, helps you find out where they are. Tracking in snow mud or dust is a must, and eliminates some of the chance encounters and makes them skill encounters. When you get it right it makes for an enjoyable hunt. Doesn't matter if you don't get one, just being right and hearing that big sucker break that timber makes you know that you were almost smarter than that elk. Sometimes you will do everything right and get him. Sometimes you will try again the next day and do things a little better.

 

Tom

Brian (BCRITES)
Saw another question you asked, and didn't see anyone else address it.
In elk country, I prefer to be back in a a ways from anything that would disturb them.  And that includes roads.  Gated roads seem to disturb em less than ones with trucks running up an down em, trails less then the gated roads.  Believe road less (tailless) areas are Elk havens.  But one has to get there if your going to hunt them!  Any way that you can get back into these areas will benefit your hunting!  Most hunters want one close to a road, or an easy pack out, me included.  Over my years of hunting Elk, I've found that it is those that make the extra effort that are successful.  I've packed bulls out (bone in) seven miles on my back (four of us x's two trips).  I've slid em out on a fresh layer of snow and dropped em onto the tailgate of my truck.  I've hauled em out on my back to the nearest gated road, placed em on a meat cart (unloaded it, an packed across areas the cart couldn't take em) and hauled em back to the truck.  Packed one on a meat cart to where we could get to it with a truck (right Skud).  Where there's will, there is a way!  You need to plan your hunt, and be prepared.  You'll have to get the meat out.  Nothing worse in my mind, than one who leaves game meat behind!!!  Don't hunt further that you are prepared to get one out!

Terry
Thanks for the info!  Hope we get one close enough that we don't have to try it, (NOT).  If you're up to it, might have you show me, even if we get one close to a road!  Looking forward ta sharing my Elk camp with you this fall.  Man are we going to kill some Wapiti!!!

jroode
Thanks for the info.  Plan to order it.

Topgun
Thanks agian!

Skud
Most times on the Washington coast, we were tracking em in the mud. LOL  Love hunting em in the snow.  Same tactics apply!  Always best when you can be ahead of Elk!!!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Thanks H20 for the reply.  I am going to prepare myself as much as a I can in OH and I would hike through the night to get an animal out if there was a chance of it spoiling.  I hopefully will get into an elk in the next couple of years.  I keep telling my wife that once she has it I won't have a problem getting sent to get another. 

Good Luck this fall I will be hunting whitetails locally. 

Brian

LawmanU27, NAHC LM, Formerly Hunteverything

Right on Brian
Only thing better eatin than Elk, IMO, is Moose.  Though, Terry did bring down some mighty good tasting Whitetail from Michigan last time I hunted with him!  As Terry said "I recommend running steps/bleachers".  Good luck to you on your hunts, hope the information here helps you and other Wapiti slayers!

Was talking with my son tonite.  Going over topo maps of the area I hunt and have hunted.  Amazing how when to put where you've seen them on a topo map, you can see the patern!  I pulled out topo maps of the areas I hunted em in Washington, compared it to maps I'm hunting now.  Nothing has changed, except the weather and presure.  Finding the Elk thousands of feet in elevation, and thousands of mile apart in the same places.  Can't help but think, I can read some State Game an Fish info, look at a topo map and have a real good idea on where to find em.  Anyone else experience this?

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Hey there bud,.. It would be my pleasure to show you my bone out method. Having a couple good scary sharp knives it the key.

 

You know,.. I have noticed that whitetails seem to pattern pretty much the same way you describe the wapiti doing it. They have a tendency to use the same types of structures to travel through and hide out in. After some 40 + years chaseing them in various places I find myself in familiar looking areas almost to the point you say to yourself "I've been here before" but in essence it's a totally new area all together.

 

 

Seeing I've only done 3 wapiti hunts going on my 4th,... there's still plenty of learning that I need to become as savvy with these critters as either you or skud. But now seeing the both you and he will be my mentors this coming fall I'm sure to learn much more this time out. Not to mention the chance to sit aroung the fire ring in the atmosphere and countryside with good friends who embrace the outdoors and hunting as much as I do. Filling the tag is just the iceing on the cake!

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Got the sharp knives, you just get your arse out here and show me where to cut!  Lookin forward to us putting a couple of them down in the fall.

Think, patterning any game animal is real important!  Didn't expect to move to Wyoming, read the regs, check out some areas, go over some topo maps, and decide to hunt the same areas as Skud before I even talked with him!  I was on Elk, first day up!  Do truly believe, topos and areial maps make huntin better for us, with (a little 'other reaserch' and) a day or two pre-scouting, think just about anyone can be hunting where the Elk are!!!  We got into em in Idaho too, didn't we 7mm Magnum!  Do your reserch!  Learn were Elk live, feed, water, and bed.  Hike in ways, and you'll be into em too!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Trackin Elk

Before I begin, gotta thank all you savvy elk hunters for your replies here.  Keep it coming!!!!

I have learned much by following the tracks of the Wapiti.  Tougher to do now that I'm hunting em where it's dry, but I keep learning.  Most of my hunting has been on the Washington coast for the Roosevelt Elk.  Tracks up there are wet and easy to follow.  From the tracks (both dry and wet), I have learned much about the Wapiti and their habits,  I have also learned Elk are Elk.  They do the same things, go to the same places, and prefer certain areas.  They bed in the same kind of places, and avoid danger in the same ways.  Don't think it matters whether they are Roosevelt or Rocky Mountain!

Tracking:
Lots to it.  Judging the size of the track (sex,age), the direction they are going.  How old are the tracks?  How many elk?  Should I follow?  How fast?  These are questions I'll try to answer for ya.  And hope other Elk savvy hunters jump in to add their experiences too!  I'll be addressing them in the order listed here!

Size of tracks:
I've read a bunch, and have found that much of what I've read to be true.  Bulls tend to be bigger and heavier.  Bigger/deeper tracks and in soft ground the dew claws show.  Though in real soft ground and light snow, even cows will leave imprints of the dew claws (and when running, everone has dew claws showing).  If the bulls are in with the herd, separating the the big boys tracks is easy.  I have seen Roosevelt bull tracks that are equal to cattle tracks here in Wyoming.  Truly believe Roosevelt's have bigger, wider hooves than the same size Rocky Mountain elk.  As I said above, when in groups, track are easy to distinguish.  And Elk are herd animals, they most often travel in groups (all seasons)( though after the rut, big bulls will break off from the herd and seek secluded areas) (very large single or very large double tracks are worth pursuing!).  You cut fresh tracks (I'll go into fresh later), three large tracks (all about the same width, length, and depth), an two sets of smaller tracks.  Odds are your following, three cows and two calves.  One very large set of tracks, 3 large, 2 small, and you got  a bull, three cows and two calves.  Another distinction I've noted, Elk like deer put the hind foot into almost the same print as the front foot.  Cows (that have born calves) tend to have the hind foot outside the front foot and slightly pointed out.  Bull tracks tend to be more in line with the front feet and in the same print.  Also you just can't pay attention to the ground!  I've found that from Augusts thru November, bulls rub trees.  Any time I find fresh tracks with fresh rubs (bark, leaves, limbs on top of everything else.  Sap not yet flowowing, inner bark exposed and still white), I'm real interested in following those tracks!!!  Determining where they are going, and how I can cut em off!

I'll address the other subjects, in order, latter.

Good wapiti hunting to all,

Dean

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Piss

Dean you forgot to talk about piss.

If you find elk beds on snow -

When elk get up to leave (unpressured) they may piss.

If the piss is at the end of the bed it was always a cow.

If the piss is in the center of the bed was most likely a bull.

So if you find a set of beds, and want to determine if there is a bull in the group look for this.

Can also be used on dirt, but where I hunt beds on pine needles and dirt are harder to find.

 

 

Skud,.. got to hand it to ya' pretty good info there! 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Skud
That's why you other savvy Elk hunters need to back me up!

They don't just piss when they get out of their beds, they shit too!  Though the placement of the urine, as Skud said, can help ya figure what your chasing.

The dropping  can help ya in a # of ways, dry, wet, or snow;

1. They tell ya how fresh the sign is (frozen sign last a lot longer and weather plays a big part in how quick it drys out.)  Fresh dropping are almost the same color inside as they are outside.  The older the sign, the darker the outside, till it's dark all the way thru.  Real old sign will be bleached almost white by the sun and hard.
   
2. That you are in a bedding area.  When Elk get up they often shit and piss, the later drys up.  But if you look closely, you'll find the flattened pine needles and the outline of  bedded animals.  The size of the beds and the # can indicate what your following and whether it's worth staying with em.  The more animals, the more likely there will be a bull with em.  And the fresher the sign the more likely you'll be able to catch up with em.  They probably won't bed there again for a long time, but take a good look around (even if the sign is not fresh.)  What you'll find is that 'Elk bed in similar areas'.  Hunt similar areas during the mid day when Elk should be bedded, (or, when following fresh tracks into a similar place, slow down.)  Lots of shit around doesn't mean your in a bedding area.  Elk let go a lot when feeding, pellets will most often be scattered or thinned out in the direction of movement.  And as when getting out of a bed, when spooked - they let go!!!  Many times I have only realized that I had been busted, when tracking Elk, when I've seen the steaming piles and all the tracks coming together in one line.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Tracking,
Direction of travel?
When following a herd of Elk, you have to follow all the tracks.  You can't just follow one!  Can't count the number of times that I have sat and watched Elk feeding on a hillside, all facing different directions.  Seen the same thing when all there was but tracks.  Tracks going up, tracks going left, tracks going right.  Been right on them many times, knowing I was close, and the tracks I was following were meandering everywhere.  Have leaned, when tracking heard animals you have to ignore the individuals and concentrate on where the group is going.  Exception, would be if the Elk are lined out and spooked, and a single set of very large tracks separates from the group (I follow those individuals.)  Following the group is easy  when it come to Elk.  Just have determine the general direction that most of the animals are moving and head that way.  If the tracks become thin (and you find that you are only following one or two sets of tracks),  I stop.  I mark my place, and move left or right (depending on the best wind) till I find the groups tracks again.  Once I know I'm close (see yellow butts, hear em, or tracks say I'm close), I try to circle around them (down wind) and set up.


How old are the tracks?
As I mentioned in the post above, depends on the weather.  Tracks, droppings and other sign, age with the weather conditions.  Tracks, and all of the other sign disappear fast with rain or fresh snow.  Tracks in mud can last a long time.  IMO, the only tracks/sign worth following are less than a day old. Hours old is way better!  (Though, you can determine the direction they where heading from sign days old, judge the age of the sign, figure how many days they are ahead of you, and hunt areas you think they might be in.)  Fresh tracks in dry earth are extremely hard to follow and determine how old they are!  Windy days will bend the edges of the tracks.  Dropping that get some sunlight will dry out faster.  Frozen droppings in the shade will look fresh when thawing out.  As hunters we often concentrate on the weather that's coming.  As a tracker you have to remember the weather that's been!  If the wind hasn't been blowing, and the edges of the tracks are rounded, old sign (except in loose sand.)  Droppings that where shaded when temps were below freezing,  I check the ones that were in the sunlight.  A tree that looks freshly rubbed, I look for bark on top of the leaves or snow, I check the branches to see how they have aged - given the recent weather and if they are laying in sunlight.  How much sap has flowed from the rubbed tree?  Goal is to figure out where they are going, and get ahead of them.  Doesn't matter if their tracks/sign are ten minutes or ten days old.  You have to hunt them where they are!

Tracking Elk is about attention to detail!  Even though, Elk don't have much of a tail.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Dean, you didn't mention the most important part of tracking elk. The pointed part of tracks point in the direction the elk is traveling, the rounded part points the way he came from. I know that is so obvious that it would seem to not need mentioning but... I was working in the woods many years ago during elk season. there was 8 to 10 inches of fresh snow on the ground. We got to an old skid road that lead back to our rig so we headed on up it to warm up and eat some lunch. On that skid road was a set of elk tracks. A big set of tracks and alone. Probably a bull. Right along side these track was a set of boot tracks going in the opposite direction. A big set of tracks and alone. Probably a fool hunter.

 

Well after we had been back in the rig for awhile this big guy walks up. He looked to be in his 70's and had a rifle that looked like it might have been a hand me down he got from his grandpa when he was 12. He got to telling us about how he had been tracking this big old bull down that skid road all morning but just couldn't seem to catch up so he gave up.

 

Good thing he gave up, he might have ended up in the spot that elk was born.

Big Lance

Now that is so funny it's sad!!!
Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

Good one Lance,

In the wet ground of the Northwest, I've followed tracks the wrong way.  When spread out in soft ground, tracks will often appear wider in the direction they are going.  As Lance said, "The pointed part of tracks point in the direction the elk is traveling".  Look down into the mud or snow, find the points.  That's the direction they are going, not necessarily the narrowest part of the track.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Come on, you Elk savvy hunters.  You all have got to have something to add?

OK, I've admitted to doing things the wrong way.  Sometimes that's how you learn.  Though, I don't think there are many here that claim to track Elk, that haven't followed tracks the wrong way (if only for a sort distance till the tracks became clear.)  Don't think back tracking em, hurts anything (cept, our pride), you always learn something (where they've been, where they're going.)  Though hunting them wrong direction, you can end up, with an empty fridge!

How many?  Should I follow?
Both questions depend on the season and many other variables!  Generally  I've found the more tracks the better the chances of a bull being with them in any season.  During the rut and for several months after the rut is over, single/double tracks might be worth following, depending on what you're after.  During the rut, I've found that satellite bulls, often hang around the edges of the main herd.  These can be anything from spikes, to old (regressing) bulls, kicked out of the herd by a dominant bull.  I generally don't follow these track, though they do warn me to be cautious.  (Though you have to be cautious when getting close to any group of Elk, lots of eyes, noses, and ears, cows or bulls.)  Back to the question; a couple of large and small tracks or even 4-6 fresh tracks, I might follow for awhile, depending on where they were going/how fast they were moving, the wind, how late in the season and wether I've got a cow tag to fill.  If I'm looking for a branched bull, I'm looking for at least 15 sets of tracks, or single tracks breaking off from a large main group (15+ animals when pursued in October or November.)  September (very early October), I think, holds em all together.  In September, truly then, the number of tracks (the size of the herd) makes a real differance.  The bigger the numbers, the more likely that a really big bull can only keep em together and keep the satelite bulls outside the herd!

Should I follow; depends on many things: weather, how far you are from camp (or a safe way back), the numbers you are following?  Have you seen the big guy?  Are you willing to settle for a cow?  How many?  What season?  Wind direction?

Every time I run into Elk I learn something, I use all that I've read and all that I have learned, to make me a better Wapiti hunter, so that next year my freezer will be full of fresh Elk meat!

I don't claim to be all knowing, and some of my observations may be wrong (I'm still learning.)  Just saying what I've seen and learned.

Sure wish more of you other Elk savvy guys would jump in!

Dean
H2O



Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

H2O Elkaholic--You just brought something up. I read all I can about elk in the off season. This post is one of the items I read, and it is better because you can actually interact with others. Learning from others is always a good thing, and the more you read the more you learn. Most people do their elk scouting close to hunting season. I do mine year round. If we are going camping we try to go where I will be hunting elk and learn the terrain. You can also learn where the elk will be at different times of the year and how they might react to hunting pressure. Some people may not be able to do that if they don't live where there are elk but they can read. The more knowlege you have the better hunter you will become.

 

The one thing you always read about is being in shape. The better shape you are in the easier the hunt and better chance for success. I went for a physical about two years ago and my weight was up around 280 and blood pressure was through the roof. I started out exercising slowly, with advice from the Dr, and in 6 months dropped 60 pounds and 6 inches in the waist. I also modified my diet and cut out most, not all, of the empty calories. Once the routine was set it was easy to maintain and hunting has never been so fun or rewarding as it is now. 

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

I do a great amount of reading on the subject of elk. Unfortunatly I live in one of those areas your speaking of (Michigan) where it isn't very condusive to try and go camping in the areas I plan on hunting. (out West)  But I do study those areas in every way and means at my disposal until I can get out to the area to do so in person.

 

Maps, books, various elk hunting threads, and a new tool (well not that new) is Google Earth. They now have a 3-D layer download and the things that it can do as far as terrain rendition is simply remarkable. I actually feel as if I have been to some of those places using that mode.

Like Dean commented about earlier,.. there's a lifetime of learning these elusive critters and then some.

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Twelch
Thanks!  I too read all I can, even after hunting em for 28 years.  I watch all the TV shows I can too!  Maybe I'm getting old but I find myself learning more from the mistakes I read or see on TV, than from those successful hunts.  When I read or watch something about someone getting busted, (wind swirls, moving when you shouldn't, under estimating how spread out they are)  I say "damn, I've done that!  That's why they ran off in November of 1989."  I've tried to get into where I think they winter here in Wyoming, think I'm going to need a snow machine or snowshoes to get back in there.  On Washington's coast, I could get to where they are all year.  Winters, as they are here, might be better if I left em alone anyway!  Here in Wyoming, as when I lived in Washington, I try to camp with them every opportunity I have.  I try to leave them alone in the bad winter months, as well as when they are calving in May and June.  Rest of the year, if I'm camping, it will generally be close to fishing, and/or where I'll be hunting.  I try to spend as much time scouting, and just being in areas they go, as I can.  You learn from watching em, and just seeing tracks of where they've been.  And, you learn from success and failures in the field.

Terry
Ahhh!  You bring us back to the maps! 

All
I'm a map hound!!!  There is so much you can learn from a good map!  I know many other Wapiti wise fellows here, do it too!  In the early 80's I began mapping out where I see them and when.  Back then it was on topo's, now it's with a GPS and mapping programs, though I still tranfer it to maps and GPS I can carry with me when hunting.  Maps are your best friend!  They show you way's to get ahead of them, potential bedding areas, how to get back to the truck, and much, much more!!!  Often locals in the area will be able to direct you to good paper maps of the area's you'll be hunting.  The ones you can get with your GPS are great, and the mapping programs you can buy and get for free on the Internet will only add to your knowledge.

If any of you disagree with anything I've said, please post it.  Can't learn to much about hunt'n Elk, and I'm still learning!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Hunting elk here where I live in Alberta its all bush and lots of it. I dont hunt alot of high country its mostly low along the rivers. Its hard hunting as there are not alot of roads but there are alot of siesmic lines. We some times scout at night to locate them and go back in the mornning to get them. Calling at night works good here as they are more active. Last year we were out calling and walking till dark. On the way back to the quads we located a bull at night and snuck back in that mornning and got him.

Walking is the order of the day when hunting elk. last year we quaded in about 10miles then walked about as much to find elk.We drove past a camp every day going in and out we would stop to talk with them on the way out.All they did is complain about how there is no elk in the country and we took two in two days just 4 miles from thier camp. If they would just have goten off thier quads and walked a bit they would got one to. But it was fun seeing the look on thier faces as we drove past camp with a bull on the back two days in a row.

One thing we get alot of here is city hunters guys that come out with huge campers and all the quads you could want.The area I hunt is only 3hrs from the city and on the weekends you should see the convoy of hunters on the highway. The worst part is they love to park in the middle of the best spots to hunt.A couple of years ago we scouted a area around a old gravel pit for about two weeks.Seen lots of sign and lots of elk but on opening day the gravel pit was full of campers from the city.We did a broad shearch for elk but could not find them.I dont think anybody took a elk in that area all year even after they all left.

 

 

fogducker---Your comments are similar to what we find in Wyoming on our annual mulie hunt.  We normally wait out the opening week crowd and hunt the last two weeks of the season and only see a few residents.  When I have been out earlier I see most people hunting close to the roads and most are complaining about "no animals".  We fill our tags most every year and two of the last three I've killed my best bucks.  To do that though I have been back off the road 2 or 3 miles and see plenty of animals.  A lot are either too lazy or too scared to get out of sight of their vehicles!!!   One guy with a California plate stopped at our camp along the main road and complained there wasn't a deer in the whole area.  Meantime as we were talking we were watching a group of deer on the hillside right above his truck about 150 yards away 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

I love those kind of stories Topgun.  Here our Elk and Deer archery seasons take place at the same time. One year my hunting partner and I had both killed our deer so we were strictly concentrating on elk. On the last weekend it had cooled off and we had an inch of fresh snow on the ground as we hiked up these steep muddy ruts that had some fresh tire track in them so someone apparently thought it was a road.  Soon this Pickup comes bouncing down the hill with four guys in it. They stopped and told us that there were no deer up there because the snow had chased them all down lower.

 

We kept on going hoping to cut some elk tracks and about a mile later we came to the spot they had turned around. Right in their track were five bucks standing there minding their own business. Three were real monsters and one of those was a non-typical with I don't know how many points. For years after that, every time it snowed a little we would joke about how all the deer had moved down to the lowlands.

Big Lance

Yep you got to get off the roads. I have seen elk from the road but it was out of season or after dark This happened to me deer hunting one year. It was getting close to dark and I was walking back to the road to get picked up. I was about 30 yards off the road in camo, no orange, and spotted two bucks 50 yards from me on the same side of the road when I heard the vehicle. A truck is coming towards me  with a rifle barrel sticking out the drivers and passengers window with two guys in the bed holding rifles as well. They were doing about 10 MPH and I said well there goes my chance to kill one of those bucks a they are going to get them. They drove right past without seeing me or the deer. They went by me about 50 yards when I touched the ML off and they threw on the brakes.You should have seen their faces when they backed up and saw my 5x5 on the ground .

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

Good info guys!  The Mulies & Blacktails too!  Do think the same of Elk.  Had Elk wander past my camp not 100 yards away.  Seen em stack up right along side the road, just out of site, waiting for a good time to cross.  Do think you get out of the truck, you'll see more game!

Another thing I've noted is #s.
Elk are herd animals, they prefer to be with more of their kind.  Some things bust em up; noise, smoke and human sent (presents), the weather, availability of food and water, ect... but generally they prefer to be with other Elk.  The more the merrier.  In September and early October when the big bulls have kicked the smaller ones out, the smaller bulls still hang around the main group.  Often the bigger, lesser bulls, will run off the smaller ones and all the small ones end up in one group.  Even the cows will group up into two separate groups, cows the herd bull is herding and cows past or yet to come into estrus.  So you end up with this big bunch of Elk, all in the same drainage - but in separate groups.  So during the rut you'll find; a herd bull escorting cows in (or near) estrus, big satellite bulls hanging in the outskirts, and another group of cows (close to the main group), and a bunch of lessor bulls hanging together (though, often they split off and try to get back to mom and the herd(or they are just horny)).
Even when scouting for rifle season later in the year, this is what I'm looking for!  Even if the Elk have moved on, the sign that they were there is obvious (late Sept. rubbed trees (some torn to shreds), tons of droppings, wallows, and tracks everywhere.)  Elk cover a lot of ground, but if you can get an idea of which way they were going you can jump a lot of ground and get to where they are now.  If not pressured (by us or the weather), they will be within a drainage or two from where all the sign was.  Not in the same #s, but I've oftentimes found them still concentrated.

You've got to hunt where the Elk are, but often where they've been can tell you much.  I am a firm believer that the bigger the #s, the more likely there will still be a good bull running with the cows.  Now the big bull that kept em all together in late September, he'll be the first to break off when pressured by us or the weather.  And the toughest to find!

JMO
Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

hello -  i'm back - One thing to remember -every elk hunting situation is different. Looks like we got a lot of cold weather hunters around - like the boy scouts - being prepared can make life easier. Especially elk hunting - Warm weather hunts usually take place during the rut. no matter what state you are in!  I'll just talk about  Arizona - Early archery hunts- during the rut- are in mid Sept. tempatures in the moutains can get in the 90's. Dropping any animal in these conditions  requires  fast action if  you are gonna have a chance at saving the meat from spoiling . Normally you got less than an hr.! Suppose you are by yourself!  -Just 1-approx.- mile from your truck/camp. What do you do? Did you take the neccesary equipment with you? Do you spend time gutting and then try to get help ? Chances are you can't even move the elk - especially if it's a big bull! What's the fastest  way  back to camp? Do you have a gps. not only to find camp agin but to mark the elk so you can find it agin!  Suppose you had to track a wounded animal for several miles. Do you even know where you are at!

The  number # 1 piece of equipment had better be a good GPS with spare batteries - and  know how to use it!!  more later  -meat care in the field.  Gary

- Poper meat care makes for the best table fare

Take everything you need to hunt as long as the light holds. The last 30 minutes of daylight often holds the best propects for the day's hunt. Don't be afraid to head back to camp in the dark. If you knock one down at last light, you will have to take care of it in the dark. Have everything you need to field dress and posssibly skin if the weather is hot.

 

Taking my own advice, I carry a good sized daypack with the following items as a minimum:

At least 6 game bags

200 feet of parachute cord

a collapsable pack frame

2 flashlights

2 good knives

a folding bone saw

topo maps

a good compass

water

food

small first aid kit

2 space blankets

matches

cigarette lighter

cotton balls coated with vaseline for starting fires

whistle/signalling kit 

small sewing kit

rain parka

2 large plastic bags

a small plactic tarp

dry socks

extra clothing based on present weather conditions.

 

With this kit, I can stay out to dark and also spend the night on the mountain if I need to. Many times I have spent until almost midnight dressing, skinning and boning an elk and then grabbed a bit of chow and rolled up in the space blankets. Dawn often finds me headed down the mountain with a load of meat on the pack frame as the other guys are headed up. Since you never know when you will get your shot, use the entire day if needed.

 

Too many elk hunters are afraid of the dark. This causes them to stay too close to the roads and often means they will miss the best hunting of the day.

Artifical intelligence is no substitute for natural stupidity.

elkaholic93 -great advice. Great advice for those even hunting in the cold weather areas. We occasionally have the warm days and you have to think about what you wrote about. It is a bad thing that any elk meat spoils.

Even in cold weather: When I gut I cut the entire wind pipe out (cut from the chest all the way up the throat. And also split the pelvis. Naxt I ensure that I cut (with an axe the inside of the back bone at the shoulders and at the pelvis and lay the carcass open. There is so much heat in the Neck, Shoulders and Pelvis. Doing this cools the animal quicker, and aids in reducung spoiling meat.

 

Shade is your freind. Use it if you can.

 

Tom

FLAGS
Your pack and mine are much the same!

1. 100 yds of dental floss (strong and lite weight)
2. 20 ft of 1/8" braided nylon rope
   
3. 2 flashlights, with two spare bulbs, and extra batteies
4. 2 good knives (I use a Buck 105 and a small buck pen knife, use the pen knife for working inside the chest cavity and such (put my index finger over the back edge to the point, where you point, you cut) makes reaching whey up in there easy, and only cutting what you want cut!
5. Steel for sharping knives
   
6. A folding bone saw
7. Topo maps (can't always depend on electronics)
8. A good compass (same reason as #7)
9. GPS with extra batteries
   
10. Water
11. Food
12. Small first aid kit
13. 2 space blankets
14. Matches (waterproof in a waterproof container)
    
15. Cig. lighter (butane lighters don't work real well when it's real cold)
16. Fire starter
17. 2 four hour wax candles (light makes the nite better when you can't get a fire started, and candles are a good fire starter by them selves)
    
18. Whistle
19. Extra clothing base on current and predicted weather conditions

I take my pack with me anytime I leave the road to hunt, even on expected short hunts.  As said "Elk cover a lot of ground", you get into them and no telling how far you'll travel, or how long you'll be out!

As for the GPS; handy tool.  Think it's the best thing since they invented the center fire cartridge!  But DON'T rely on it!!!  Beginning of the Gulf War, mine had me miles from where I knew I was (think the military commandeered the satellites.)  Also deep canyons and dark timber hard to get a signal.  You drop it, sit on it, or for what ever reason it fails, YOU NEED TO KEEP TRACK OF WHERE YOU ARE AND KNOW HOW TO GET OUT!!!  Elkaholic 93 is right, when working properly and you know how to use it, a good GPS will get you out quickly, even in the dark.  And it will get you back to the same place in the morring to pic up where you left off.

Dean
H2O


Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

My pack, which is a fanny pack with shoulder straps,. is the same as Dean's with a couple of minor differences.

 

Only one flashlight, only one space blanket, no candles, nylon twine instead of dental floss and I rarely carry maps because I usually spend a tremendous amount of time learning the area I am hunting.

 

Then along with my two hunting knives I have a pocket knife and my leatherman tool. I have a straw type water filter because I don't like to carry much water. Too much weight and noisy. A role of surveyors tape. several four gallon plastic bags with twit ties. There good for the heart and lungs or mushrooms or berries or any other tasty little morsel I might happen to find. A small digital camera and a small tripod. Oh yeah, TP. My favorite food while hunting is a mixed nuts with a bunch of dried fruit mix together. That's a lot of fiber.

 

I also carry a predator call. Mostly because when nothing much is happening it is fun to call in a coyote or bobcat or something. But also I have called in both deer and elk on several occasions.

 

This picture was taken at a distance of about 20 feet after calling with a predator call.

Big Lance

1. Plastic container of dental floss (Dean's idea given to me while hunting with him)
2. 25 ft of climbers braided rope
3. 2 flashlights, with spair bulbs, and extra batteries
4. 3-4 good knives (cutting, skinning, de-boneing, & pocket folder) 
5.  1 twin carbide blade knife sharpener, & a honing stone
6.  Folding bone / limb saw
7. Area Topo maps 
8. Lensatic compass
9. GPS with extra batteries
10. Water
11. Food
12. Small first aid kit with a tube of super glue (stitches in a bottle)
13. 1 space blanket
14. Matches waterproofed in a waterproof container with starting material
15.  2-3 butane lighters
16. Fire starting material in a small ziplock baggie 
17. 1 four hour wax candle
18. Emergency whistle
19. Extra clothing based on the current, and projected weather conditions
20. Pin-on emergency strobe lite (like what's on life preservers for a location beacon)
21. 2 small packs of hunters tissues
22. Range finder
23. "Black-Diamond" light (worn on your head) for the ability of 2 handed night-time processing of your kill.
24. 1 roll of surveyors flourescent plastic tape
25. FRS/GMRS radio with spair batteries
26. Extra ammo
27. Compact binoculars

 

I'll normally carry the backpack on planned full day outtings (before daylight to dark), for the days that are split into morning and evening hunts I'll wear a waist style fanny pack with the bare essentials normally used for the times not far from the base camp.

 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

hello -  of  the three  packs  i only see one -Flag - who is actually prepared to handle a downed animal - the others  are  great   for surviving a night -out  but -  the  game bags -plastic bags  and  tarp - seal the deal  for me and by adding  the folding pack frame   and  he's  gonna have all tools  neccessary to  be able to skin - debone and take care of the meat - !!

 

http://wildlife.state.co.us/wildlif...bsp; 

this is the deboning  dvd   good information -- Gary

 Poper meat care makes for the best table fare

I suspect the others are like me. After the animal is tagged and gutted it's back to camp for the game bags, pack frame and hopefully some help.
Big Lance

I also have "HCH game bags" (36"x48" 4 ea.)  but I keep them on the quad in a saddlebag where they are available if needed.

 

These are heavy duty canvas drawstring bags that are washable and re-useable.

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

hello -  no problem - just  checking -  As  far as going  for help or even  back to the atv - all wasted  time - time is meats worst enemy - takes  less then  1/2 hr. for meat to start to spoil , especially if the hide is left on- even in cold weather the hide insulates the meat causing it to spoil!- How far to help or  the atv?  How long  before you can get back ? 

Most hunters out west  now opt . for the guttless method of deboning -by the time you gut an animal - I can have the elk hide split from rear -to ears  and cut down one side and have the front leg off and ready to work on the rear leg.

 Once animal  is skinned - 1/2 at a time - we cut the meat right off the downed animal and get it in some kind of game bag immeadiatly. basically 4 pieces per side - front leg - back leg- backstrap and take all the meat off the ribs ,brisket and neck in one slab(hamburger)- turn over repeat -then roll out paunch(inards)and get loins  and heart  and what ever else you may want -  Usually takes less than an hr. - with help less than that !  Cut meat can be laid out on hide or a plastic tarp/rain poncho etc.   but should get into somekind of gamebag,  ASAP!  we also like to cut open the big rear legs  and remove  the  bone - opens up the biggest piece to cool better - meat can bone sour easily - by not packing out any bones  the wieght is almost cut in 1/2!   Each cut of meat should go in it's own gamebag - throwing  bug chunks of meat in a heavy canvas bag does little to help the meat cool properly - needs air curculation-  in fact it generates  heat -  Gary

 Poper meat care makes for the best table fare

 

 

Gary,... apparently you didn't read my post towards the end of page 1.

 

I DO  debone,... simple process,.. I also have done the gutless method of haulin' out game (whitetails) and it's pretty slick. I just haven't had an oppourtunity to give either a whirl on a Wapiti as of yet.

As far as gettin' the bags are concerned,... that's  one of the many reasons to carry a GMRS/FRS radio,.. while your cuttin' someone else will be comin' with the necessities.

Hopin' to change that this coming fall,....

 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

hello - yes - i do actually  read  the comments - if I was repeating anything - it's just to make sure we all understand the importance of proper meat care-

Everyone has their own way of doing things - time/place/different situations make for endless varitables- I'm just saying the better prepared and  having all items - at hand can and does make the job easier and a better end result !- 

 No offense meant to the way everyone hunts or the different ways the get the animal out of the woods  and  take care of the meat!

good hunting - fill your freezer --

as far as calling  for help - i've yet to see a radio that actually works over more than a mile and has to be in open terrain -  maybe the new rhino's  but i cant afford them -  i'd also say most of my elk hunts  have been solo -archery and going for help was not an option!  like I said you need to be prepared!  gary

 Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

Hey Gary, GOOD Info!
What's in a day pack is a balance between, you surviving, and what you'll need to take care of the game.
I've killed a bunch of Elk, and packed out a bunch more for friends and even people I didn't know.  Haven't lost one yet.  I don't pack in big coolers and dry ice, but if the weather is expected to be warm, I do go in prepared.  I've thrown the game bags and pack frames on a meat cart, hauled em five miles in and stash em close to where I'd be hunting.  Picked them up on the way out when the days hunt was over.  I haven't packed game bags (in my day pack) with me while hunting, yet.  You have to consider the weight of your pack, how far in you're going, the expected temps, and how long before you can get the game out.  I suppose that if it was going to be warm enough that I thought I'd only have hours to get the meat out, the game bags would be in my day pack (along with a camo T-shirt.)  Think most Elk hunting is done at elevations and at the time of year, when you got a little time to get the meat out.  There are ways to give you more time.  Hunt together; the more guys you got with you, the easy it is to get the meat back to camp quick.  Use snow to cool the meat.  Hang it in the shade (preferably down low next to a creek)(hell, if the creek is spring fed and deep enough, you might even consider placing the meat in the creek (with the hide on.))  I've used my space blanket (and dental floss) to make a lean-to to keep the sun and the heat off the meat.  Getting the hide off is important, but without game bags, flies can ruin the meat as quick as the temps.  I do carry a couple of large plastic bags, but you should cool the meat some before putting it in the bag (the more cooling the better).  If nothing else, put as much meat as you can carry in your day pack, or tie it to the outside and head for the truck.  And then head back in to get another load.
I have to admit, many times it's a race.  But if prepared, it's a race easily won without having to carrying a 100# day pack!

Sorry Gary, but my pack will always have more gear to make sure "I" get back to camp!  If the meat get's back, then you can be sure I got there too!!!

JMO
Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

- Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

Gary,... I can fully understand your point of protecting your meat and having the temperature of it cool down as fast as possible. I'm certain that is just about any hunters main goal after they have made their kill,.. I know that it's mine.

 

I also realize that your "business" is the "ultimate game bag" and your trying your darndest to promote them with the last 4 posts,.. I think you have pushed the taking care of your kill pretty much with each. Every hunter I know tries to cool and care for their meat as soon as possible,.. the key being AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.

 

Different situations however can and will happen,.. which in turn will cause different lengths of time in which you are able to do so. I think your stressing that point 4 times now on this thread has served it's purpose.

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

hello -   good  luck  with your  tag   or   antler  stew  !  Business -  right - As much as I'd like to agree -  since you seem to be the only one  whinnin - why do  you hunt ! besides the outdoors experience  and the love  of  nature  - pitting yourself  against  an animal - the rush - the excitment-  the challenge- etc.  etc.  ??  

 on a further note - as i look back -  who's the one trying to impress everyone  on this deboning  skills  etc -  i didnt bring the  subject  up -  -dude -   gary

 

 Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

I didn't see Terry doing any whining.  He was just telling it like it is.  After four posts pushing the proper care of meat and your tag line right below, it was rather obvious that you are doing a little free advertising   I guess there are no rule violations or anything, but IMO most of us are more than knowledgeable about field care and cooling meat as quickly as possible.  Now what was the name of that business again DUDE

 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

 hello - I meant no offense to anyone -  - sorry about the whinin  comment -

If I preached to much - sorry- not my intent to promote !

lots of people on these forums use business's in the signature  area -

I was hammering  home the being prepared!

Believe me or not !   

experienced hunters -  as most of you seem to be - every hunting trip is different !  we all are set in our ways!

Gary

 i had just recently found out about adding avatars  and  signatures -

 

 Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

Gary, Terry (or should it be Terry, Gary?)  Man, am I confused!!!

Come on GUYS!

THE THREAD IS ABOUT "ELK SAVVY"
I don't agree with promoting your own interest here on the NAHC Board, but Gary has contributed valuable (I believe) information about hunting the elusive Wapiti.  Can't say that I haven't done the same, I have my opinions about huntin Elk, and have presented them here.  I have also invited those that don't agree with mine, to post their opinions.  elkaholic93 and I merely have a difference of opinion on some (and I emphasize some) items that should be in your day pack.

Think I have packed out about some 35+ Elk.  As I said above, haven't lost one yet to spoilage.  If there is new gear out there, that will help me make that 40+ with no spoilage, then I'm interested in hearing about it.  I haven't checked out the link in Gary's reply.  And would probably field test it for a couple of years before I would endorse it. (one reason I do not field test NAHC items any more, to short of a reply time to evaluate the gear.)

Point is I believe everyone posting here falls into two categories:  Those who are Elk savvy sharing, and those learning!!!  Truly think you can define it to one,  we are all learning!!!  I have yet to meet anyone that knew it all, and and those that said they did, were wrong!

JMO
Dean
H2O Elkaholic

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

ok -  how many here are trophy hunters- Do you pass up animals  to get in the score book  or are you just trying to fill the tag first chance you get .

I know most guides try there best to get a respectable bull  for a client!

What catagory do you fall into -

#1 -  I'll shoot the first elk - no matter what size  the antlers

#2 - I want at least a 5x5

#3 - I'd like to shoot a 6x6

#4 - It's gotta score at least 350

#5 -400 or over 

Hunters who start setting goals for the size antlers , will most likely go home empty handed. Most  ,Archery  Hunts are 15 days  during the rut here in Arizona . Weather can vary  year to year but mostly warm days and cool nights , throwing in a little rain. I hate to say it but here in Arizona it's pretty common practice  to pass on 300- 350 class bulls the first few days - I'm not just talking -(or bragging) -  about experince hunters but guys  from out of state and beginners. Mainly because Az is know for some real monster bulls being taken every year, and so do a lot of other states! The main problem is high expectations -  the setting limits on what you'll shoot and won't shoot! - For an experienced hunter thats  ok but for beginners  and even out of staters - monster bulls don't just walk by everyone in the woods -   I was with several hunters from michigan a few yrs. ago - the first 3 days  each hunter had an easy shot on bulls - like 5x5 - 6x6 , nice bulls - even 300+ bulls  but passed in hopes of killing  a really big bull! They all woulda settled for a spike by the end of season and  went home empty . - Did they have a great hunt - yep- do they still apply each year  to try agin - yep! Killing any elk archery is a huge accomplishment reguardless of how big the antlers score.

One more story- A guy in camp during an early  archery hunt - first time hunting anything- he was accompaned by a very experienced freind who was basically guiding for him. Each night they had great stories of getting close to some nice 5x5's -6x6's  some as high as 350. The hunter wanted to shoot each one but his friend told him -no-and  kept telling him ,he can get a bigger one. His guide had to go home for a few days  and reminded his freind  not to get excited  and wait for him to return and he promised a monster - just be patient. That very next  night we come back to camp  and this hunter wasn't back and the quad/trailer was gone . when he arrived in camp - he told us he had a bull down - we asked how big - he wasn't sure but it was big ! Upon arriving at the bull - he had killed a 4x5 that might net 185 if lucky - he was the happiest guy in the woods and justly so -  he had done it hisself. we spent 3 hrs  trying to find a way offf the mtn . in th dark.  When it comes to harvesting an elk -  what makes you happy !   Gary

 Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

Dean - I think there is only one kind of elk hunter because we both know everyone is learning. No elk hunter knows it all - even if they think they do

I am a trophy hunter. Every elk I have shot is a trophy to me. I also shoot "The First Legal Elk I have a Clean One shot opportunity to take and make". So I am a #1,#2,#3,#4,#5

For me, it is kind of hard to classify people into the two categories - Trophy Hunters and Non-Trophy hunters.

I personally have different categories:

#1. Slob (Hunter) - someone who doesn't respect the game, rules or land when hunting. At times the word hunter should be deleted and Slob stands by itself.

#2. An elk hunter - someone who is willing to learn whatever they can about elk hunting. They use their experience and the experience of others to have a great experience.

Sorry Dean that this string is going away from Saavy - I really do not like talking politics

Elkaholic93- Good stories and experiences on the examples. I have seen the same situations in Wyoming. I try and find out what the motivation of those that hunt with me is and if they would only shoot a particular size, thats fine with me, but I do advise them that big giants are few and far between. If they are looking for any elk, I advise them to "Shoot the frirst legal elk you see and have a clean shot at, because you may not see another the rest of the season".

Tom

When I'm hunting elk, I'm trying to fill the freezer.

 

Using that as a guide, I'll normally take a shot at the first legal elk I see. Normally, I'm carrying a cow tag and I have absolutely no problem putting women and children at the head of the line. I've shot my fair share of bulls mind you, but as I've gotten older, the meat and the hunt have more importance to me. I've personally taken over 25 elk, including a bunch of raghorn bulls, and some 5x5s and bigger. I've also been in on the taking of well over 100 elk of both genders. One thing I've noticed is that no matter how long you cook the antlers, they're still going to be too tough to eat.

 

That being said, I have been trying to draw a bull tag for Unit 2 in northwest Colorado for years. I've got 14 preference points and it takes about 16 to get the tag. So, I'm starting to get close. One good thing about Unit 2 is that, while bull tags are extrememly limited, cow tags are plentiful. So, for many seasons, I've been able to hunt cows in the exact same area that I'll eventually get the bull tag for. This is an extremely good way to scout since I've been able to learn where the elk hang out during the season and where the waterholes and bedding areas are during the actual season.

 

When I do draw that tag, I will not fill it with any bull that is less than a 6x6 with at least 50 inch main beams. I see at least one bull of that caliber everytime I've hunted that area, so I feel really confident that I'll be able to find one when the time comes. So, for that one elk hunt, I'll join the ranks of the trophy hunters. But, other than that hunt, if it is a legal elk, I'm going to pull the trigger and will sing with joy on every step of the pack out because me and Momma will eat good that year.

 

Flags

Artifical intelligence is no substitute for natural stupidity.

    Hello -  I  think someone mentioned  the subject of scents while hunting elk earlier.

Which of the smilies fits your scent  in the woods? feel free to add your own.

I know we all like to think that the new scent free /blocker camo will make every hunt a success. I'm not trying to take away the value of being scent free. Normally on an archery elk hunt-10-15 days  - I have at least 5-6 sets of camo's  all as clean and scent free as possible and each stashed in the extra large zippo- for easy packing.

Showering in the woods  can be quite comical- for you guys in the north woods  are thinking  showers -- right! I've seen the hot  solar water bags - the guys with camp trailers and the outside hook-ups  have it easy. I'll warm water on the grill and do what i can - once a day  - if possible  to wash  and rinse. Keeping  clean can make the difference! plus you feel better . We've over the years had a set of - elderly gentelman- they bring one set / maybe 2  and wear it the whole season. They both are smokers and by the end of the 4-5 th day even I can smell them coming. The one guy will chew  juicyfruitgum inbetween smoking -  that smell is really  strong. i dont think they fill a tag very often - maybe a rifle hunt. Most  camps have fires - I never wear my camos around the fire  but will change into other clothes and  let the pair I wore for the day  air out over night- if possible!   enough said  about personel hygeine.

Do you use scents to attrack elk?  The ever famous  elk urine wafers. I bet i still have some in my hunting bag. pin it on your hat if you dare,takes a while to get use too.  Every year more new stuff hits the market - rutting  bull - elk fire - lots of choices. How many differnet bottles do you have. Has anyone  tried the new  elk herd  product  from  VS1--   http://huntingscents.esecureorder.net/scents/  click on the elk scent - I've heard nothing but good reports  from  some of the other products  they carry . I guess if you can't be scent free at least try  to be a familiar scent  of the woods.  Especially if  you  are a spot/stalk kind of hunter- mainly because we all know the wind is our worse  enemy!  I like to sit blinds near water holes  in the evening - especially after an unsuccessful  long day of hiking/stalking. I got into the habit of crushing the juniper needles -pine needles  and  spreading the scent on my camos. while i wait- A great cover-up scent is made by http://huntingscents.esecureorder.net/scents/.  this stuff works  great . For my elk hunts the juniper is my choice ! For desert hunts-deer - i switch to sage.

In my younger years  i'd step in every cow-pie  and pickup elk nurds  and rubbem in my cap - anything to smell like the woods- Guys  make their own out  scents out of items - twigs - leaves- dirt from there hunting areas  to tossin with camos - Here agin  everyone is diferent  in the way they hunt!

I.m not saying being scent free or using a sex scent  or a cover up  will make you a successful hunter . But it can make a difference !   Gary

 

Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

As far as scents go I have taken a bath in a lake in November, water temp around 45 degrees. Wasn't  a long bath but still a bath. Take military baths when not by a lake or stream. I also carry unscented baby wipes in my pack for when mother nature calls and you had chili last night. Sure helps keep you clean and baby soft. As far as the campfire smoke goes I have seen deer and elk in the middle of a controlled burn with stumps smoking around them while they ate. My conclusion was smoke doesn't effect them since they have that smell naturally occurring around them from time to time. As long as you are not using your campfire as a trash burn pit. Now human odor or other predators will make them high tail it out of the country. I don't use scent lock or cover scents but I do wash my clothes in non-phosperous detergent and pay attention to the wind always. I store my hunting clothes in those airtight plastic bags you can suck the air out of with a vacuum with pine or sage. Makes them easier to transport and keep normal household scents off them. 

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

OK,.. now here's one I can jump in on Cover Scents and Scent Control.

Waaayyyyy back when I first started hunting I was introduced to cover scents by my father who was the person who introduced me to this new wonderful world of hunting. Back in those days there wasn't much to choose from and there were 3 sold on the market for hunters to utilize.

 

1. A paste like acorn scent that came in a metal pushup tube that you'd apply to just about every portion of your exposed skin like a deodorant stick.

2. A bottled liquid Skunk scent,.. I smelled it from the bottle just one time,.. it's bad enough having the real thing pay you a visit let alone purchasing the stuff !!

3. A bottle of Fox urine,.. didn't want it near me either.

 

As far as concealment there was camo back then, but the majority of the hunters at that time still believed in their Carhart's with black and red plad wool shirts and sometimes matching pants. There wasn't any such thing as scent lock suits, and all the other little gizmo's that they are trying to sell to all of us now.

 

 

I have always looked to the the hunting days of past for guidance.

 

 

These hunters of yesteryear always had huge bucks hanging in their camps,.. and also had the pictures to back up their claims of those big bucks. No gimics,.. they were pure hunters at heart who followed the basic rules of hunting,.. stay downwind, be as quiet as possible, and know where they feed and bed down.

 

I've always tried to follow those same basics whenever I hunt. 

 

I do believe in a cover scent,.. I personally like those "earth scent" wafers and wear them religiously. I also wear camo as I feel with the broken patterns they sport do help break-up your image of a large moving solid figured blob which I think they do notice. If they can't smell you, they may become leary of something they don't think as normal and can become quite challenging at times. (whitetails just love stomping their hooves at you to see if they can get you to move even the slightest bit). Unfortunatly I haven't gotten into a situation with that to test it out on Wapiti as of yet with the exception of that one spike-horn with Dean that year,... but Dean had a couple of cow calls goin' keepin' his attention thinking we were the oddest lookin' cow elks he'd ever seen.

 

I don't believe in all the hype,.. OR expense of these scent loc hunting outfits, and as far as the cover scents go,.. just storing your clothes in a closed plastic bag with some sort of man made cover scent, or a couple of pine baughs would do just fine by me. I'm not going to spend that kinda' money on hunting clothes to make some sales marketing dude's pockets any fuller of my hard earned $$.

 

Hell,.. just hang all your hunting gear outside where they can air out overnight if worse comes to worse. Might be a little chilly when you first put em on but after the first 10 minutes in them they will be just fine.

 

That $$ is better spent on reloading supplies, optics, rifles / rifle upgrades, etc. in my book!

 

 

Cover scent gum ?? Oh come on,... give a guy a break !!!

 

I'm not that gullable! But of course I'm sure there are some people who use it and hope it works.

 

If you stick with the basics of hunting your gonna' do just fine,.. those are my thoughts an' I'm sticking to them.  

 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Terry I think that is why the thread was named "elk hunting savvy" and not elk hunting technology. I agree with you 100%. With the new BDC scopes why would you worry about bullet trajectory when you can just range and put a circle where you want to hit? I haven't seen one that compensates for wind drift. Soon the hunters will lose the ability to calculate wind and elevation and lose the true skill of shooting just by putting a dot where it should be. How many hunters practice everyday on judging ranges when you can just use a laser rangefinder? What happens when you are on a wilderness hunt and the batteries die? Besides if you work on your true hunting skills enough you should be able to get close enough where range is not a factor. Some technology is good but I think we are going way overboard and losing the skills of yesteryear. Marketing to line somebodies pocket is the big part of it but the bigger part is hunters falling for the gimmics.

I am more interested in the skills of hunting and learning than buying the newest gadget to make it where I don't have to pay attention to the woods around me. "I can forget the wind and just hunt" to me means my senses are not at the top of the game, opposite of why I hunt. You can also keep your senses tuned year round if you rely on technology less and "hunt" year round.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

I'm also in your camp.  I don't go out looking for all the fancy clothes and gear either.  I watch the wind closely and use fox urine for a cover scent when I'm bowhunting and that's about it.  The whole thing about hunting is using your skills and senses like was said and I love seeing how close I can get to an animal.  I'll shoot out to 300 yards in Wyoming where a lot of times it is impossible to get any closer.  However, the closer the better and more fun IMHO.  I don't need a range finder for that.  If he looks too far in my scope that I can't hold on him, then he walks.  I do a lot of yardage guesstimation when I'm out doing things during the year and it's amazing how accurate you can be on distances if you constantly work on it. 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

I'm down right anti-technology when it comes to hunting. I don't like to shop, I like to hunt.  Hell, I bow hunted for ten years with a finger tab I made from the leather of an old boot and my knife sheath is one I made 20 some years ago from an old leather bag my wife had.

 

Having said that, there is one piece of technology I really do like. GPS. I used to feel that getting lost and then finding my way back was some of the most fun you could have in the woods. Then one day I had to walk an extra five or six miles in the dark. When I finally got back to camp it accrued to me that I am just not as young as I used to be and that extra mileage along with not getting back to camp until one in the morning just plumb wore me out. I still get lost but now I can head directly back to camp with no extra mileage on my poor old feet.

 

What TWELCH said about hunting all year long. I may take that to the extreme. I am an animal watcher. That's like a bird watcher on steroids. I have learned to identify every species of bird, mammal, reptile, amphibian and fish in my area and I throw in a few crustaceans and mulloscs just for fun. I keep an annual list of what species I identify and compete with myself from year to year. So I am hunting all the time. I just saw an Orange Crown Warble out my window a few minutes ago. I already had it on my list but I still had to check it out.

 

By doing this, no matter were I am or what I am doing, every little movement catches my eye and every sound is noted and identified just in case it might be something I don't have on this years list yet. It keeps me sharp and is a lot of fun.

Big Lance

I definitely agree with you about using a GPS.  We could not hunt the places we hunt out in Wyoming without one.  We make our maps and put all the property line waypoints on them.  Then we know exactly where we are and have no chance of getting onto private property while we are out there.  They also come in real handy when you need to get to various waypoints to make it back to camp.  Several times in the dark of the moon I would have been like Lance and been half the night getting back to camp if I hadn't had my GPS along.  I always carry a good compass though because you never know when electronics are going to fail!

 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

Again great info!  Thanks everyone!
Gotta love it when multiple Elk savvy hunters say the same thing.  Tells me, that it's not just me that have seen the ways of the Wapiti, it confirms some of the ways that I hunt them.  And I have learned some new ones reading the replies here.  Everyone here has added to what I know.  Can't thank you enough!  Elk hunting ain't easy!  Do believe what we all share, comes back to us.  Has to me!  I might not share where I saw that monster 8x8 (unless you're in camp and hunting with me.)  But I'm willing to share all that I know to help you find your own monster, put one on the wall, or Elk meat in your freezer!

Those new to hunting the elusive Wapiti, my advice would be to asked your questions now.  Judging by those replying to this thread, I'm thinking you've got over 150 years (total) Elk hunting savvy posting right here!  No dumb questions when it comes to hunting em!  (Oh, by the way, Elk are vegetarians.  Had a hunting bud, his first time Elk hunting, get into a bunch of them real, real close.  He ran about 2 1/2 miles back to the truck, stopping to puke a couple of times.  Seems we never told him Elk don't eat meat.)
Now that's a camp story I can tell you all later!  Beware of man eating Elk!

Dean
H2O



Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I skimmed from the beginning to make sure someone hasn't covered this and the closest I came was H20 Elkaholoic's post of covering ground. When I have to cover long distances walking and am not close to elk, or at least I don't think I am close, I try to eliminate extra noise but I don't pussyfoot through the woods. Elk are big animals and they make noise when walking. What I do is change my stride to try and not sound like a two footed hunter but a four footed elk. About ever 50-100 yards I give a chirp on the cow call. I have had bedded elk answer me and know it is time to slow down. 

They seem to be more relaxed when they think it is an elk and hear the cow chirps. I was walking through the woods like this to meet one of my hunting buddies. I did not know he was watching a herd of bedded elk across a canyon. Yes I went down the wrong ridge to meet him but that is another story. He told me they all turned their heads in my direction and a few of them got up out of the bed looking in my direction. I hit the chirp and one chirped back so I stopped. He told me the ones that stood up bedded back down again and the others relaxed and most quit looking in my direction. They still paid attention to me but I was able to get closer to them than if I had just blundered in. He told me he could not hear my walking but could hear the chirps. He said they would have left and I never would have seen them.

I have done this numerous times to get close to elk I would have scared out or walked right by. I have also coverd a lot of ground like this and found nothing. This can be really effective when hunting pressure is light and you don't have to worry about other hunters.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

That was an intersting post. Do you think there's any difference in the response you get based on the time of the year?

I don't think so since elk are vocal animals. I have heard them chirping in the spring when calves are finding their mama. I use this pre-rut, rut, and post rut. During the rut I will bugle to locate bulls and use estrus cow calls (  Hyper lip, Hoochie Mama, and diaphragm mouth calls). The only difference I have found post rut is the big bulls slip off by themselves and you will find the young bulls with the cows. I usually put in for cow tags post rut, which I consider after the last week of October, if I don't get my draw choices of during the rut. I have noticed there are two ruts, the main rut in Sept. and early to mid Oct mini-rut for any cows that come into a second estrus.  I even started to do this deer hunting if elk are in the area and I have kicked some mulies out of a sound bed.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

I've also used a cow call to calm Elk before, and after encountering em..  Done it in July, August, September, October, and November.  Doesn't give you a free ticket in but it will often buy you the necessary time to set up for a shot, change direction, or move in.  You have to freeze when they answer you back (all eyes will be on you.)  If it's close to the rut you may want to stand your ground and chirp some more?  Most times when they answer you back or you can see them, you need to immediately determine the wind direction, and back off if you need to and get down wind!  Problem often is; once you've called, they know where you are and the Elk you can't even see are looking at you.  It's a dilemma; to move or not to move.  I don't think there is a right answer to "what now"?  It depends on the circumstance.  What I've seen is most Elk hunters don't move.  Fear of being seen keeps em standing in their boot tracks till they hear the Elk moving off.  Big mistake IMO, unless the wind is in your favor and they are moving to where you might get a shot as they pass you by, or if it's the rut and you might call a bull in!  Most times that I have bumped Elk (with a call or for any reason), I give them some time to put their heads back down and I BACK OFF in stealth mode!  You know where some of them are, it's time to evaluate how many there are and a bunch of other things! What's the wind direction, how spread out they are, what direction are they headed, are they bedded, is it the rut?  Man, the questions flying through my head when I get into them to flies fast.  But it generally ends up with me moving!  I move, to keep the wind in my favor.  I move, to back off and place myself ahead of them.  I move, to find a better shooting lane.  I move, to get closer.  Guess you can say about 90% of the time I end up moving.  Can't preach enough though, if they are looking at you don't move!  Even if it means they all run off because they got your wind.  Best you can do if that happens is be ready to shoot.  Keep your eyes moving, eye all the animals you can (light colored animals are often the bigger bulls).  Figure out how many bulls are in there and how big?  What direction are they headed?  And if one gives you a shot, take it!  If you didn't drop one, then you know where they are going and whether you want to pursue.

Practice quick shot's, Rifle or Bow!  These critters often don't give you much time before they decide to head out!

Hope this helps some!
Dean
H2O Elkaholic

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

With 107 replies to the thread, and 2033 views, and 150+ years Wapiti hunting experience posting here, I gotta think there's a bunch of new Elk slayers reading?  Also gotta think that there's more of you reading that still have questions.  Ask away!!!

Lance, TWELCH, Topgun, and all the others.  Do thank you for adding your knowledge here!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I to have to agree with the tech thing I think it gets out of hand sometimes.  I use a GPS just got it for Christmas so haven't used it elk hunting yet but looking forward to the functions on it.  I like have the topo maps on it where I don't have to carry a bunch of paper.(I do carry a basic map just in case)  As far as other stuff I can judge ranges pretty well.  I don't have a range finder my Dad got one a few years back and in hunting situations has used it maybe 2 or 3 times.  He used it for me once which it helped but I don't think it was needed.  I do carry allot of things not needed to hunt in my pack though but if I have to stay out over night I would use it then.  Never know when the weather is going to change I do live in Montana and it could be 70 degrees when you start and freezing ass cold later so be prepared for the worst.  I have been learning about elk hunting for allot of years now and am still learning so keep it coming guys. 

 

As far as something that should be in a survival pack I do carry a pack of jerky or summersausage to give you added protien if you happen to get stranded while hunting. 

 

  

OTSS, Disclaimer-All views and opinions in this post are of my own and not subject for change as I can think what I want when I want and will not be held acountable for the pissing and moaning brought on by reading said words. G&M Wild Game Processing, Helena, MT "You Guttem We Cu

Excellent information on this thread. Thanks Dean, Tom, Mike, Jim, Lance, Rick, Terry and the rest of you for sharing all of this information with us.

Hiker....Proverbs 3:5-6; NAHC Life Member

Dean, You got it right that 150 things race through your mind and one is to move or not to move. The one thing I can add is some don't think when they call. It is not a matter of walking through the woods chirping away but rather an art form of a sort. I try to be close to cover, working my way into the wind, with brush between me and the way I am going. That way I can stay concealed and have time to make decisions. I can proceed forward or back out depending on what I decide.You can peek around brush and tree trunks while keeping most of your two legged form concealed, hoping to see the elk before they see you. Think how you would set up for turkey or coyotes and apply it to elk hunting.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

Good tip Todd!  I was running and gunning during the turkey season up here last year on a two track.  I had been calling each time I got to a decent tree and nothing was happening.  I got careless and let loose with a call while I was walking and several gobblers cut loose all at the same time.  I was lucky and made a 30 yard sneak to the next bend where there was some light brush I was able to get concealed in.  After 30 minutes or so of cat and mouse a nice bird came in and got wacked, but I learned from that mistake real quick.  You can never assume anything or let your guard down, no matter what you are hunting!

 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF NRA US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

hello -  I'd like  to add a little  trick  that  might make the difference. From my experience -  countless times  while  walking  thru the woods the surprise of looking up  and seeing an elk staring  right at  you gives  you an instant responce of  stop and look. even tring to get  apair of bino's  up for a better look - 99.9% of the time - the second you  stop and make eye contact -  busted- they turn and  bolt  away. 

What I've learned to do is not stop - never look straight at them - it's  hard to do . I'll slow  my pace  glancing if possible  to keep the elk in sight - make a minor  change in direction if needed - act like you didn't see'm . look for tree/bush to partly concele  your  movement of drawing  a bow or lifting  a rifle  to shoot. Slow  your  pace  agin - but don't  stop  so when you step past the tree/bush you are ready to shoot .

Give it try next time  your scouting  and get surprised by an animal  staring at  you. They probably  think they are still hiden ! it  does  work !  Gary

Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

I agree with you Gary.  A lot of times an animal won't take off until you actually make eye contact with them and then they are gone in a flash!

 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF NRA US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

Wow that was a lot of reading.  As everyone has pointed out hunting these elk is an ardous event.  On average an elk will travel 10-15 miles a day.  They are freaks like that, so do be in shape.  I've experienced everything read and learned through experience.  One thing not noted was that you need to give an area some time.  What I mean by that is more than 1-2 seasons.  You need to learn it.  So the first two seasons hopefully that happens because your chasing the elk around it and begin to learn where they go and hang out.  I've hunted the Nanum since 1990, with a bow, and have endured many regulation changes to what it is today.  I know that area by the back of my hand and where they will go with or without pressure.  I will bugle and cow call and use many different types.  The elk there rut starting sometime mid to late sept and the season ends before they stop so I don't know when that is.  This last year I picked up the primos "hot lips".  Unbeleiveably I drug some elk in.  Since it was new I didn't have alot of practice and my hunting partner said it sounded like a kazoo.  It really is alot harder to use!  I also use a ton of cover scent just in case of those unexpected times of bieng caught in the wind.....it does confuse them and buys you a "little" time. 

On another note a few years ago my hunting partner got on this site and some guy invited us to his camp and we went....having lived in the western side since 1981 and friends telling me where the GIANT elk live and why I knew we were going to be in for a hunt...I met some really nice guy's and even climbed down that freaking mountain to the camp after chasing the elk around all day.  We made a plan fopr the next day and a couple of guys from the next camp shot the 5x5 out of the herd.  Remember that Dean.  I'm glad to see your doing well.  Hope to run into again someday.  These are a great bunch of guy's.  

Yep, remember that well!  The kid that arrowed that 5x5 should have been hunting miles from us with my advise.  Same kid dropped a 6x6 last season that Lonnie had arrowed, and was following the blood trail on.  Said he was still pissed at me for inviting you firefighters up to hunt with us.  Enjoyed hunting with ya, and having you in camp!  Thanks for adding your savvy here.  Shoot me an email dbowers54@aol.com
Dean
H2O Elkaholic

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

TWELCH
Gotta agree!  A few years ago while hunting a gated road in Idaho, I stopped in a wide circle at what appeared to the end of the road.  There were two skid roads, one dropping off the other going up.  Standing in the center of the circle, I broke out a call and made a few mews.  Immediately an animal came running right at me, turned out to be only a  Elk calf.  It stopped about 30 ft from me and checked me out.  Didn't like what it saw and ran right straight back up the upper skid road where it had come.  I being dumb, (dumb, if a calf is nearby other Elk are too!) (we learn from our mistakes), I called some more to stop the little guy and see what would happen.  Before I could even move, his mom (with him in tow) came running right back down the same trail, me still standing in the open circle.  "Getting busted by a calf, maybe not a big deal."  "Getting busted by mom, and hearing the rest of them chirping and busting out of there when mom barked and turned inside out to head back the way she'd come, PRICELESS!"  Though I don't think I'd call it "PRICELESS!"  Just learning!!!  I now never call from the open, I always have some kind of cover, before putting the call in my mouth!!!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I've had the same experience as Gary, talking about eye contact. Many times while trying to stalk within my short bow range I have been busted by an individual elk I hadn't previously seen. Simply by freezing in my tracks and bowing my head so that the brim of my hat covers my eyes I have often convinced that elk that I was of no threat.

 

The problem is that elk don't have anything more important to do than to stand there and stare at you. It may be five or ten minutes of standing in an awkward position before the elk relaxes and moves on or barks and bolts. During that time every fly in the world will land on your nose and the mosquitoes will fly in your ears and feast on your blood.

Big Lance

hello - Ok- you've hunted  hard all morning - opening  weekend  archery elk season  -weathers ammasing - light winds -slightly overcast-temperatures in the mid 60's lower  70's . you've been chasing  elk bugles all morning -  time  for a break -

here's what happened to me - found a nice  spot in the  shade  - it's  probaly  close  to noon - you know all the elk are bedded  by  now - so  time  to relax a bit - munch on a snack - trail mix-energy bar - jerky -   you set your bow down - take off  day pack - get out  gps  -water  bottle snacks .

 I just sat  down  opened my water - was checking on the gps for my location - not really paying attention - I hear something walking  and a limb snap - Look up to see elk walking my direction - less than 50  yds  and closing -  Can't move !  I watch  6-7 cows  and calfs  walk by at 30 yrds.  thankfully winds working to my advantage - It's  awesume - then here  comes the bull  huge  5x5  a monster  - close  to 300 - an apsolute bueaty - I'm sitting on a downed log  with my pack by myside , water  bottle in one hand , gps in the other hand   bow just within  reach .  this  bull stops  at  25  yards  and  walks  back and  forth like a model on a runway. he was within bow  range  for at least 5 minutes  and i couldn't do a thing  but  sit  and watch -

. It's one experience I'll never  forget - Don't assume all the elk bed down early !  I actaully sat the same spot the next  day, at about the same time and low and behold here they come agin. This  time  i was prepared but  the bull never  showed -  go figure !   Gary  

Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

Big Lance
LOL Gotta hate them bugs!

On the eye thing, seen it both ways.  Had em off and running for nothing I can figure but looking at them.  But, have also look em straight in the eye at three feet.  I could have counted their eye lashes as they passed.  Each put there head down after staring at me for a bit, but then bobbed the head back up for another look.  Know if I moved or even blinked, I was busted bigtime.  No bulls with em, so it was just learning.  Do think it's better to avoid eye contact most of the time though!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Your going to get the same response from a whitetail if you make eye contact with them. They'll stomp their hoof to try and get any kind of response or movement from you.

 

Eye contact is the killer, they will spin a 180 and high tail it outta' there.

 

 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

I have seen the same stamping the hoof, with Elk.  Also had them bark at me (yep, Elk bark) and have had them false charge me (running right at me, and stopping short.)  Most often this is done by one of the lead cows when she knows something is not right, and like Terry said she's is trying to "get any kind of response or movement from you."  Don't blink, but even if you don't blink they will probably move away from ya.  But you now know what direction they are going. (Elk will frequently move in a straight line, you can almost draw a line on a map and shift a 300 yds or a mile or more and find them.)  If you blinked, they are gone in a heart beat.  But if you were patient and waited for them to all to go away (no eyes, no ears, no noses), drop away from them downwind and as fast as you can circle around to get ahead of the em on their projected path.  Set up with cover!  Often I have found that the cow that spotted me is still far back in the herd and has not made her way to the front.  She may be bringing up the rear and watching their back tracks, so don't track them, circle around them.  Bulls will generally be toward the rear too.  Often 2 to 7 animals ahead of her.  Key is to set up away from where you think they are heading (most often a straight line), let some pass and move in as soon as you can.  Move to within range with a clear shooting lane.  Too close and you're busted before the bull gets there, to far back and he passes you out of range or with no clear shooting lane.  The more shooting lanes the better, but you gotta be down wind of them!

Hope this helps some!
Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

hello -  well  hallelujah    and  thanks be given -   I got a  left-over  archery any elk tag !!!   AWESUME -  Now  i can put  some  of this great information to work  for me this year . Since it's a left-over I don't  lose my bogus points ! It's  a nov 6 th thru the  19th.  so  no  chasing  screaming bugles  but hey  I"M GOING ELK  HUNTING !!!!!    Gary
Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

Edited my above post to provide more info.

Congrats elkaholic93!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Glassing,
I prefer to glass from points that offer me good views into areas I know Elk frequent.  These can be watering areas, crossing points, feeding or bedding areas.  I'll do a quick scan of all open areas and then begin to concentrate on looking into the timber.  Most Elk I've spotted have been on the north or east facing slopes in thick timber, frequently in second growth trees (jack pines) less than 9" in diameter.  Early or late morning or evening,  in areas where they are pressured, you'll often find them moving from the openings to the cover.  In areas where they are not pressured, I've seen them bed down mid morning right in the middle of an opening.  Glassing the openings is the quickest way to find them.  But there are openings even in the thickest timber!  One yellow butt, can put you on Elk.  As said above, you have to cover ground to find them, and glassing is one way to cover a bunch of ground without wearing your legs out.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

hello -  every   fall we  got one  spot  that  is almost beyond belief -  for the past  10  + yrs.  a group of elk get together on   a lake bed  here in  northern Arizona -  Morman lake. It's about  2 mile  long and a milewide  rectangle - starting in late aug  as many  as 800 elk can be seen on the lake bed.   In some yrs.  more  and some  yrs.  less -  It's an awesume  sight to behold! . I'm  sure some groups come and go  but for the most part they spend almost 2 months  right out in the open! I  haven't been able to spend  alot of time checkin them out  or getting pictures -  but I will this year  for  sure ! To watch  this many elk at one time  is  Awesume  to say the least - Kinda like a sancuary during the  sept. rut - there is no real way to hunt them - which is legal at this time . Usually just before the youth hunt in mid  Oct.  G$F  takes  quads and  runs all  the elk off the lake bed.

The lake bed can have up to a foot of water- in places. It mostly depends on the run-off  or the  snow pack --  Back in the earkly 80's  the lake was 4-5 ft  deep - but due to drought it has never recovered  from drying up one year.  Gary

Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

I have found the same thing!  Elk hang where they think they are safe.  For twenty five years I hunted along the Washington coast.  The area was boundaried on three sides by the Olympic National Park, and the Elk knew were that boundary was. Cows live for twenty or twenty five years.  And the oldest, lead the herd.  They know were to go to avoid presure and assure safety!  The Elk in that area moved across the Park boundary at their leisure.  I've set my bow and rifle aside and ventured into the Park, both before the season and after the the shooting started.  Guess that exsplains my disdain for those that don't hunt them leagal.  Anyone can kill one in the Park!!!  What I have learned is, that there are parks outside of the Parks!  Elk will stack up in areas that have food, water, cover and they are not presured (not necessarry in that order.)  Presure can be just a truck driving down the road and stopping.

Locals can always tell ya, where they always see Elk, (I can for the areas I've hunted) there are holes that hold em.  Think almost all of them will have three things in common; food, water, and safety!  If the info is current, check and hunt these areas often.  Lead cows learn and change the patterns of the herd.  Migration also play a part.

Hope this helps some!
Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Back to Glassing:
Generally I prefer to glass (and hunt) the north and east facing slopes.  You can find em on the south and west slopes, but those are more open and easily seen into.  Both are often steeper ground and Elk will move there to escape pressure.  You can often cover those areas fairly quickly with a good pair of binoculars, and move on.  The north and east facing slopes generally have thicker cover, and requires a slower approach.  You have to glass slow and look between the trees, look for the yellow butts, and movement.  If you spot one and look more closely often you'll see a bunch of them (90% of the time).  If you spot just one, or two (and your sure there are no others) chances are you're looking at bulls, even if they are so far away you can't see the horns.  I've seen a cows and calves together by themselves, but not often during the times we'll be hunting them.  I've shot three bulls and know of many more taken, that were by themselves by early November.  Know that not everyone can hunt them during the rut or when they are bunched up, just some info I've observed.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Well I won't get to chase screaming bulls but I will get to hunt them mid-November. My elk hunt is two weeks after my deer hunt in the same unit so I guess I will be elk scouting two weeks before the elk hunt and hopefully come across a muley.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

TWELCH
Glad to see ya bring some of your savvy back to this thread.  Missed ya!  I use the same escuse to my wife, it's deer season! (When I'm really scouting Elk.)  Most of my Elk huntin has been in early November.  Have hunted em a for few years with a bow when they are screaming, and a few years in October too!  Love all the action of September, but think I like November better than October.  Things are more settled down, a little more normal when it come to Elk movement, and habits. Bulls are where they are going to be, a lot of the pressure has headed home, and Elk get back to doing what Elk do.  Good luck on your hunts!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Been busy with school again. Went back for second career and mid-terms are next week so it is hard to study while thinking about hunting. I did buy and install the Garmin topo software for my GPS today and just got a chance to play with it. It is impressive as I am doing a lot of scouting with satellite photos and the topo software before burning gas. Found a lot of meadows, deep canyons and water sources before I start using shoe leather. If there is a spring on the map I can click on it then navigate to satellite photos to see the country. I will only have to drive about 90 miles to be in what I think will be my hunting spot this year. It all depends on what it looks like when I get out there.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

Sounds like a great program!  Now get back to work and get an A in all your courses, LOL!!!

 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF NRA US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

 

Well ,.. it looks like Utah has done it again,.. don't know all the specifics yet but another monster was taken,.. just had these sent to me :

 

 

MY TURN !!!!!! 

 

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Wow, and another fantastic one with a bow!  There's nothing like hunting them in the rut up close and personal.  Come on September!!!

 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF NRA US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

Yep ...............I'm jelious <sp?>, And whoa what a monster . I've been reading the posts here and have gleened alot info from you guys ,if I ever get to elk hunt ,I know that I've gotten good solid tips from the pro's .

TWelch , I used to live in Rio Rancho ( 10yrs ago) and from Roswell ,still have family there .

Sonny Some people are educated far beyond their intelligence . -J.Clower-

hello -  nice  bull  -  looks to be a 400  class bull - just  a  guess -  do you know what it sscored ?  gary
Proper meat care makes for the best table fare

Sonnyone-- My parents live in Rio Rancho and I have friends in Roswell if the aliens haven't taken them. I lived all over the state and finally settled in Los Lunas.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

Great Info on this thread. In the short time I've bow-hunted elk (4 yrs) I've seen most things posted here to be true. I beleive it's Imposible to predict where the elk will be on a given day but I learned something great last year: We(party of 3) went into a spot on the first day in the mountains and as soon as we entered the woods we let out a chirp and got 2 bulls to reply about 150 yards away uphill. we closed the distance and set up with one caller and two shooters spread out. the caller did a great job and brought not 2 but 5 satelite 5x5's straight to us. My brother shot one within 1/2 hour of the hunt and did not disturb the others. the caller kept calling and the bulls meandered around for another 15 minutes not getting close enough but still bugling. they slowly moved off after that. We celebrated quietly and stayed quiet gutting the kill and packing it out. We decided to give that spot two days rest and went back in and the exact same senario happened again(only 4 bulls this time though). we set up in the same spot and took another. the only thing is this time one of the bulls bolted out of the area when he passed the other gutpile so I assume that spooked him and not us. Not disturbing the area and alerting the elk of our presence I think paid off but I have to wonder if we were to have gone in the second time on the very next day if the results would've been the same? I firmly beleive that elk are a creature of habit when not disturbed and in thier comfort area with food and water. They move about on the same trails at the same time of day in and out until they are disrupted. will they be in the same spot this year? I'll find out but I have to beleive that if they are'nt pressured before we get there then they will be.

Ahhhh!  Bartender, I'll have an Elk on the rocks!

Don't know how high he scored, but the extra points (next to the G4s) are deductions for scoring typical.  The Roosevelt's I hunted it's common & counted.

Another note; Elk don't like loose rocks.  They'll cross rock slides on well worn trails.  Even on the river bottoms they avoid loose rocks, they use the sandy and small gravel areas along stream beds, and prefer to cross streams were the rocks are small and packed.  That being said; Elk will go where ever they need to too escape, and drop where the fall.

robtaurus
I wouldn't base your whole next hunt on finding them there.  Often bulls will return to the same area year after year.  But not every year and not necessarily during hunting season.  I'd check the area every three or four days during the season, if they're there, hunt em.  If not, move on!  JMO  And I agree, if not spooked, you could have hunted em the next day in the same place.

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

So what?  That's the end of the savvy?  No one got anything to add to hunt'n the elusive Wapiti?

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I want to thank everyone that added his savvy to the thread.  I also know that there is lots more info savvy elk hunters could add.  Each of us has observed there regular habits, many have detailed minor habits.  Each observation relayed here, I believe, has helped someone 'new' to hunting the elusive Wapiti, and benefited those of us 'savvy' and still learning Elk hunters.

Thank you all for your post and answers.  And thanks to 'ALL' for your questions.  Truly do hope the info here has/will help someone!!!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I,ve gotten a few ideas from here and I've been chasin em a while now. One thing I know that I didn't see here but may have missed is the fact that they respond to calls differently than they used to. Conditioning I guess. I notice the same thing with any other critter that hears calls all the time.
I Trap

I went out looking yesterday. I found one waterhole that appears to have about 6-8 elk watering at it and one maybe two mulies. The size of the mulie tracks appear to be bucks as I had to look twice to make sure they were not calf elk.. It appeared 4-5 elk come into the tank from one way and two come in from a different way. I think the two are bulls and the 4-6 are a band of cows/calfs.

I think that is where I am going to hunt if I don't find a better place as the road is a pain to get down. The tank is five miles from pavement with a forest service dead end road sign at the beginning. and with that little sign, both elk and dead end, I might not have company. There is also the perfect ambush place to watch the tank, 100 yard shot maximum with a deep saddle 50 yards to the west. If  I hunt there I will post a picture of it.

The wife is also getting upset with the elk calls in the house so I took them with me and got a response to a bugle at 1 pm and it is just the beginning of August, not even close to rut time. The only difference here are all the east slopes are open and the west slopes have the trees on them..

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

Sounds like you found the perfect honeyhole Todd!  It sounds like a great spot, especially for your muzzleloader.  I hope we can find a couple spots like that over in the Gila for the 2010 hunt, especially for your daughter!

 

Topgun----30-06 NAHC LM NWTF NRA US Army Vet Corp SP5 68-71

WOW Thank you guys for this post. I eventually want to go on a DIY elk hunt, so it was time to start the learning. This is a great place to start. My first of probably many questions is what state would you recommend for a first time rookie looking to go elk hunting?

Hi there Don,.. first off welcome to the wonderful world of Wapiti huntin',... and YES this thread that good ol' Dean started up is a great start to the learning process. There are plenty of years combined hunting encased withing just this one thread.

Now,.. let me suggest something to you. Just about every year now for the last 6 there has been an organized elk hunt and get together (GT) held in the great state of Idaho.  It has been started by a fellow life member who resides in the state and would be PERFECT for you to attend. This year Brother Ray won't be having it due to some unforeseen circumstances but I'd be willing to bet that next year (October 2010) he will resume the tradition. This is a DIY style hunt BUT,.. there are normally enough regulars that attend that can pass on info, share hunting styles and  techniques, and some are even willing to take a newcomer under their wing. AND,.. the tags are over the counter, first come first served so you won't have to wonder IF you get a tag or not like in a draw style.

If you go to the life members thread and look for the sub-thread called "6th Annual Idaho Elk Hunt and GT" and read through it,... and then use the website's "search" engine for the 5th annual one and read through that, you will get an idea of what I'm talking about.  Once you get there if you go, Ray takes all of the new people (and some of the repeats go as well) out to the areas that elk are normally found and give you a point in the right direction.


After all of the different areas are shown and discussed to some length the rest is up to you.

Have yourself a good read, the 5th GT thread is quite lengthy! If interested you will have a whole year to get yourself ready for the hunt of your lifetime.

Good Luck to you!



. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

That is awesome. Just the thing I was hoping for. There's nothing like having experienced people helping you out. It beats the way I learned to hunt deer almost all trial and error, mostly error, but then that is the way we learn....and half the fun. It always helps to have someone point you in the right direction. Hopefully it'll be on for next year. Thanks again to everyone sharing their knowledge and expertise.

This thread will probably get longer shortly as right now everybody is probably hunting or getting close to their elk hunts. Hopefully one day I can get up to that get together as it sounds like it is awesome. Right now with school age children it is hard to get away for any length of time, especially out of state. I have been pouring over maps and getting out to the area I plan on hunting as much as time and money will allow.  Seems like I have one or the other but not both at the same time. Welcome aboard dondon 1!

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

I would like to thank all who have posted here. As a new elk hunter. once in Mt. and this year in Ky. I have found this thread to be very interesting and helpfull> Thank you all!! Rick

Well, I'm back.  Awesome season!  I was into Elk every weekend (that's a first, in long while.)  They where bugling early, first weekend.  Think it peaked here last weekend?  Got rifle season yet to fill my tag, but truly awesome just being out there with them this time of year!!!!!!!

Made some mistakes this season, thought I'd pass em along.

1. Moving to fast thru a bedding area: Twice this season I busted right into em in an area I knew was a good bedding area, though I'd never been there before.  definition: Bedding area, thicker timber, relativly flat, tipacally on north or east facing slopes or ridge tops.  I intentionally circled around the areas so I could come in down wind, and after a couple of hours found myself just walking, instead of hunting.  Busted into both bunches at less than 40 yards.
2. Chased the wrong bull: 10 minutes before shooting light, I wasn't 30 yards from the truck when I heard a bull bugle.  I answered, and a second bugled back, first one sounded off again.  I called again, and a third one answered in the direction I planned to hunt.  I went after the third one.  First two where at a quartering wind, #3 was up wind and in the direction I planned on hunting.  Never found him or any other Elk that morning.  That evening I circled around to where I had heard the first two.  Elk tracks and droppings everywhere, worked my way to the ridge line, they where screaming just below me, seven or eight bulls.  End of day light ended that hunt.  (Lesson: I had headed off after a satellite bull, first two were close together and more likely closer to the main herd.  Though more work and distance to cover, I should have circled around to get the wind in my favor and pursued the first two.
3. Don't know what I did wrong? (maybe some of you Elk savvy hunters can help me out?)  I was hunting a series of small ponds, with bedding ares in between.  Jumped a bunch at about 40 yards.  They went left, with sage brush below I expected them to turn and move up.  Had the wind in my favor so I moved up and side hill to the next pond.  No sign, so I continued side hill to the next water source.  Ton of track both into and out of the watering hole, on four different trails.  I was above and left of where I'd last seen the Elk.  Decided to set up. Put up a small, light weight blind I carry in my pack and hunkered down.  After a couple of hours, I stood up to stretch....Elk, Elk to my left.....  Dropped back down behind the blind and got ready.  They were coming right at me, about 40 yards out they turned and took the trail headed up.  I just knew they were coming to water, so I held tight. (and watched em all go by, just out of range.)  After it was quiet, I tried cow calling, and then bugling.  A couple of bulls answered the bugle, but they where way up the hill by now and it was getting dark.  So I packed up and headed back to the truck.  On the way down I followed their tracks coming up.  They had followed the water source up.  No need to water were I was sitting.  Only thing I can think of I did wrong was setting up on the trail to the water, should have maybe set up where the four trails came together?  Guess that's Elk hunting!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Well, back again.  Was into Elk about every other day during the rifle season.  Passed on shots at small bulls an cows.  Helped pack out a couple, and just enjoyed the hunt.  Come on 2010!!!  Can't wait to get out there again!!!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Morning all,..

I had a GREAT time hunting the hills of Wyoming with Dean, saw plenty of elk and elk sign while out there. The areas we were in were alive with mulies, and speed goats as well. Life was abundant everywhere.

We were also greeted with a surprise amount of snow the day we headed out to put up camp and had to backtrack to a different area that we weren't counting on for the first day in until the snow had melted a bit so we could reset in our original planned area. I over did it the very 1st day of the hunt and pulled a groin muscle (ouch!) and had to lay low for a few days to mend up plus the altitudes we were hunting in played havoc with me in those uphill climbs but I still enjoyed my time out in the hills,.. Wyoming is BEAUTIFUL country !

We got to hook up with "Skud" and some of his gang while out there,... a great bunch of guys (and gals) we all got the chance to pass some hunting information with each other, and even got to hear the story about "Miss Kitty and her cubs".

As always,.. this elk hunt for me was yet another learning experience in the many ways of the Wapiti. I'd again like to thank Dean and his wife for all the Western hospitality, and Tom and his gang for sharing their campfire a couple nights with us,....

I'LL BE BACK !

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
. Shoot Straight & Stay Safe ! ,..........
. Terry Webster,...
. NAHC Life Member,.
. NAFC Life Member,
. RMEF Sponsoring Member,..
. SCI Member,..
. Michigan Sportsman's Assoc.,
. NRA Life Member,..
. US Army - Nam' Veteran SGT E-5 1970-72 1st/327th /101st AB

Finally finished this long & wonderful thread... a ton of great information and I hope to use some of what I remember next week for 4th Season here in Colorado to try & fill my cow tag this year.

 

Thanks to all who provided & shared your knowledge with those of us that haven't been doing it nearly as long...  This is amazingly-good information that just can't be found anywhere else!

 

Thanks again - good luck and safe hunting to all!

 

P.S. I'll try to get back on here and share what I remembered, what worked, or didn't... and share the result of my hunt too.

“Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself! They are the... people’s Liberty Teeth... under Independence." - George Washington // NAHC Life Member / NRA Member / U.S. Army Vet

So - I have another item to share.

Not something I learned this season, but something that I experienced again this season.

Know the territory that you are hunting as intimately as you can. Know each stand of trees. Forest Service Maps, and especially Google Earth are extremely valuable.

I killed a cow this year, and here is how.

Another Hunter and I got a late start leaving camp in the morning. And as we were driving to the area we wanted to hunt in the truck, a Cow and Calf jumped from the stream bottom up onto the road in front of us and crossed the road not 50ft ahead of the truck. We did exit the vehicle and quickly climb the hill to try and get the elk.

Well we didn't get a clear shot and the elk really just disappeared.

I told my hunting buddy to not be upset about it, that those elk could only go a few places - and we had a good chance in running into them again, and the place they most likely could end up is where we were planning to hunt.

We went on with our original plan, and we were doing what I call an unorthodox hunt, we were hunting areas that were mostly pockets of trees in mostly open areas. We hunted two miles from the truck hitting every stand of trees, some of the pockets of trees you could see around, some you could see through. Some were as few as 30 trees on a sage brush hill. We hit nine of these pockets and had traveled 2.7 miles total before we were coming to the last stand of trees. How we hit eah stand was one person used terrain to get above and in view of the opposite side of the stand of trees and one would either still hunt through or near the other side of the edge of the trees - not driving the woods but hunting them.

Well on the last stand - I worked to get to the stand of trees using terrain. Then I approached the trees just above the lower edge - I did give my buddy time to get above this stand. As I was entering the stand I heard some animals take off - I assumed they were deer. I did my best to find an opening to get a look at the animals through the stand to the other side, but could not see anything. I did not hear shots from my partner and again I thought they sounded like deer.

I then heard something below me and there was the Cow and Calf cruising away and below me, then she stopped - and I shot her and down she went.

It appears that she must have seen my hunting partner pass the trees on the other side, and instead of heading up and away towards him, she went down and away - an alternate escape route.

I looked at my watch and I had shot the same elk I had seen five hours earlier - because I knew each pocket of timber on this ridge. She was actually within 700 yards (as the crow flies) of where I had seen her in the morning. Be pesistant and know the areas and the habits of the elk. If we had shot at these elk in the morning - I would believe that these elk would not have stopped where they did.

 

Tom

This will actually be the 2nd time hunting this area here in Colorado - and since it's further from home than our usual camping or my deer hunting area, I've been working to "learn & search" the area heavily on GoogleEarth and topo maps... great resources to utilize with the "areas to check" noted in this thread.

 

I'll be heading to a different part of the area this year as we hunted up high last year (near the Continental Divide) and saw nothing but sign & track (full-moon & 60-degrees at 10,000-feet daily didn't help...).  I've already had two buddies note they saw deer only up high this year (2 weeks ago...), and the other one took his cow about half way between the way-high-ground & where the "Winter Activity" is noted for Elk at this location...

 

I've seen several references to some calling here in this thread (though to be fair I read it over a few days here at work, so I might have missed it) - but does anyone have a recommended method to learn to call them?  I have a Woodwise HyperHot Cow call now, but am learning (as noted in one thread here...) that it's more of an art form than anything.  Anyone have any tips for learning or listening to elk "chirping"?  The instructions with this call are adequate, but no substitute for the real deal & now I think of this just in time to head out hunting of course too!

 

For example - one chirp or several?  Vary it?  Any difference between chirping & mewing?  And so on...

 

I know the "Hoochie Mama" has been noted a few times too - but I guess I'm "old school" (or want to be...) and don't like the idea of just pushing/squeezing a "button" when I hunt - even if it is simple & works.  (And yes, I'm just a cheap bastard at this point too...)

 

~Jason // "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have." ~Thomas Jefferson // NAHC Life Member / NRA Member / U.S. Army Vet

Jason, I have a woodwise and a sceery call that are always with me. I rarely use them. I watch elk videos and listen. With season after season in the woods I listen. The elk where I hunt during rifle season rarely chirp or mew during the day when the hunting pressure is on. I hear more in the Morning and Evening. If I remember I might mew or chirp if an elk  or what I believe was an elk busts away from me in the timber, so far I can't say that doing this has been successful for me. I have had hunting partners Chirp in a spike or lone cow, also calfs will come.

To me one day, I will be able to say that the cow call helps. I do believe that on occassional mew acts like a cover scent for me. Sometimes when I feel that elk may be near and I just did something like step on a limb and made a too loud noise, I will mew. It makes me feel a little better.

I have chirped and mewed and have been answered by elk. So it definitely does work as a locator.

One year I shot a calf that was with a cow and another calf and the cow and calf remaining trotted up the hill and stopped, we chirpped and mewed back and forth for many minutes - I could see the cow and calf the whole time. I mimicked the cow and it was a great learning experience.

I would say beware of replicating what you hear on a video of a huge herd of elk where many elk are talking. Try and be one or two elk at the most. The more you watch and listen in the woods and on video you will hear that calfs and cows and the age of the elk do sound different, also the quickness and sharpness of the call means different things. I am sure that one of the Chirps means "run and run fast" try to figure out which one that is and don't use it. A video of a herd of elk relaxed and they are calling would be best to pick out one mew and replicate that mew. This in my opinion would be the best way to start. 

The one you don't want to make is a short, sharp, loud chirp or barking sound.  Do that and they'll bunch up, line out, and headed for the hills as soon as the first cow heads out.  Elk are like people, no one has the same voice.  They all sound a bit different, but they speak the same language.  It's not so much what ya sound like, as much as what you're saying.  Most Elk videos and tapes are recordings of Elk undisturbed when they are mewing an squealing and just keeping in touch with each other.  All these sounds are good ones, even if you mess up once in awhile and don't sound quit like em.  Most are soft and tranquil.  Cows in heat will often get a bit louder, and the mew is a bit longer; but it's still soft and not sharp.

Keep it soft and mew a few times, and wait.  Often multiple Elk will mew at the same time, so it's ok to sound like more than one and overlap the calls.  Check the area around you thoroughly, and move before you call again unless you know Elk are close.  Elk are almost constantly moving.  Even when bedded, there's almost always one or two up moving around.  Thus, the only time I have ever heard elk mewing a lot from the same place was when it was another hunter that didn't know what he was doing.  Elk move, and so should you when calling.  Don't move when they are close, unless you're sure there are no eyes on ya.   And don't call when they can see you, it's to late unless you have someone set up behind you doing the calling.

Good luck!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Great info and thanks for those details...

 

Well I covered a lot of ground in four days and then had my season cut short by a day thanks to old Mother Nature... started snowing Friday night and then got progressively stronger through Saturday and if we didn't break camp (just under 10,000-feet!) when we did on Saturday afternoon - I think we'd still be up there trying to get out.

 

I did see three cows on the opening evening, but they were about 150-yards below me and in some deep timber - and I mean DEEP!  One very large cow, one yearling calf, and then one in between near as I could tell.  When I started down the hill the wind was in my favor, but about the time I found these cows it started to swirl & then change.  As I glassed the big cow looked in my direction & I knew that wasn't good... so I started to put the binos down & get the rifle up and that's when they appeared to wind me and bolted back the way the came.  That was my best chance overall.

 

I think I read in this thread that someone noted they will haul @$$ after them - not to even remotely catch them of course but to see which way they headed, so that's what I attempted to do... until I realized that not only was the timber thick, but there was deadfall EVERYWHERE and in all directions where they were too!  (Not that I would have been heartbroken working my tail off to get one dressed, quartered, and out of there though...)

 

One thing I noticed big time as I walked back up the hill & past exactly where they were standing when I spotted them - the "elk smell" is very unique and, at least in season, a bit intoxicating too (maybe it was the tag burning a hole in my pocket still too - NAH!).  I don't suspect it happens much you can wind them before they wind you, but it's been a couple of years since I stood over a downed elk and it was interesting how that lingered... it must have been about 20-30 minutes after I ran after them that I got back to that spot (in the dark...) and it was still pungently strong as I paused and reflected on this missed opportunity.

 

Thanks again for all the great knowledge & information on this thread - now to hopefully draw again next year and get another chance to learn and experience this wonderful privilege we call hunting.

 

Be safe out there!

~Jason // "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have." ~Thomas Jefferson // NAHC Life Member / NRA Member / U.S. Army Vet

You can often smell Elk before ya see em.  The Elk smell is most pungent where they bed.  They will lay down an chew their cud for awhile, then get up and move around for a bit, sometimes bedding back down somewhere close to where they first bedded (within a hundred yards or so).  Just about every time they get up, they relieve themselves.  And they may bed back down in the droppings and urine or a flat place where another animal dumped.  Elk bedding areas are loaded with droppings and urine.  And the odor smells a lot like a barnyard and sticks with them to a minor degree even when not in a bedding area.  Also, often when Elk are spooked and just before they bolt, they unload.  If you're down wind (like ya otta be), you'll smell them before ya see em.  If you can see them and they start unloading, you better be ready to shoot, cause they're about to be out of there.

Better luck next time, Elk huntin can be addictive!

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Here is what happened on my elk hunt this year. Saw several bulls and about 30 cows. We didn't get closer than 300 yards to them with the ML so no elk in the freezer this year. Lost 2 days on a 5 day hunt to swirling 30 MPH winds. This is what I learned.

Opening morning I was by myself, picked up the daughter at a half way point from the wife later in the afternoon. The wind was non-existent and it was before sunrise. I wash all my clothes in scent killer and spray down all my gear with scent killer. I was walking up a road without a light. I was letting my foot go down softly and feeling for loose rocks and twigs that might give away my presence so I was quiet as could be.The coyotes were yapping about 400 yards from behind me.

I was standing next to a tree waiting for the sun to come up and start still hunting. I had about 20-30 minutes until it would be legal shooting light. I had been there about five minutes when about 20-50 yards from me I heard a bark. I was thinking should I cow call if it was an elk and if it wasn't an elk will I call a coyote pack into my lap in the dark? I stood there like that thinking what should I do. About 5 minutes after the first bark there was a second bark about 50-100 yards from me in the same direction as the first bark. So I stood there thinking do I cow call if it was an elk or possibly call a coyote pack into my lap in the dark.

Five minutes later I had my answer on what I should have done. ee-ooo,ee-ooo,ee-ooo and I could hear the elk lining out up the hill through a saddle. I think in the dark they might have seen movement from me but since I was behind the tree they could not tell what I was. I also have camo clothes that blend in really well with the terrain I hunt so I think they could not see my outline. Since I do use scent killer and there was no wind they could not smell me. The first bark was a question and I should have cow called to put them at ease that I was just an elk. The second call they still did not know what I was and was trying to get some reaction. Since I had not moved or answered them they decided it was time to get over the mountain. Next time I will cow call and coyotes be damned if you come into my lap in the dark.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

When the elk barked they were already alerted to danger. Either you another hunter you didn't know about or some natural predator. Not the coyotes. Coyotes do not prey on elk other than maybe new born fawns, to do so would be suicide for the coyote. It wouldn't have hurt but I doubt that the cow call would have put the elk at ease. It certainly would not have called the coyotes into your lap. Not that that is a bad thing, coyotes don't prey on people either. I almost never pass up the opportunity to call coyotes into my lap. I just love seeing how close I can get them to come.

 

It doesn't sound to me like there was much you could have done to change the outcome. Every encounter is different though and you have to decide what you should do in each instance. With me, it is usually the wrong decision but that is what makes it fun.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Big Lance... If you feel the need to lie in order to support your cause then perhaps it is time to reconsider your cause.

I think they knew something was there but not what. If I had been fully busted by smell or sight it would not have taken them 15 minutes to clear the area. At least that is my past experience when fully busted by elk, they gone in seconds. In the past in full daylight I have put a herd back to rest when they heard me. They were on the other side of a ridge from me and heard me. Seems like they are always on the other side of the ridge from me. On one occasion I cow called and stopped. I slowly worked my way to the top of the ridge about 20 minutes later and they were bedded about 50 yards from the top.I watched them for about 30 minutes through binos and could not find a bull so quietly went back out the way I had come. Another time I raked trees during the rut with a squeal bugle and some grunts. About 10 minutes later I had a small 5x4 come over the hill to investigate. Never got the herd bull but they did not leave the area.

Other hunters were not in the area. This is a spot most hunters don't think to look but elk are there. Imagine a 3 pointed y. The tops of the y are all saddles over a mountain range. The bottom of the y intersects with a major paved highway and the road from the highway only goes about 400 yards to a water tank. You are on national forest land but only about 1/2 mile from private land. I never would have looked at this for elk but heard about it from deer hunters in there the previous week. I can hardly wait to go camping this summer and learn the land better. Hopefully I can get drawn for this area again next year.

 

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

I think Lance is right, once they bark, they are on to ya.  Cow call might have helped???  Anytime I've herd em bark, it's like you said; they know something is wrong, just not what it is.  I've seen them bark, stomp their feet, and false charge, trying to get whats bugging em to move so they could identify it.  Pretty sure they knew it wasn't Elk.  Every time I've heard em bark, I could not move because their eyes were on me, and they ended up hualin ass without me moving.  Might try a cow call, I've never tried it.  Never been able to get one to my mouth with them watching me and all.

Don't know how much light there was, but my guess is they saw ya.  Might have just been your image going between two trees.  Something they recognized as not being Elk, something wrong and they were just trying to get you to prove em right.  After a bark, they're leaving, even if you don't give them the proof.  JMO

Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

I guess I'm in Todd's corner on this one.  I doubt they were real alarmed in the dark like that if he was standing against a tree for five minutes before it happened and another 15 minutes before they headed over the hill.  A cow call may or may not have been the ticket, but I don't think it would have hurt a thing to have tried it.  I think you can fool them just like a whitetail if they think something is wrong and can't pinpoint it.  However, let them or a deer get a whiff of human scent and it's a whole different story.  I also think that if you make a little noise when you are still hunting that you can get away with it, as long as you don't expose yourself or get up wind of them because they make a lot of noise as they travel along.  An occasional cow call seems to settle them down and I think it might have done that in Todd's case, but it is all just conjecture now!

 

NAHC LM (1991), NWTF, NRA, SPC 5 Army Vet Corp 68-71

It was about 30 minutes before legal shooting light. We can start hunting 30 minutes before sunrise so sunrise was around 7 am and legal hunting started at 6:30 so it was around 6am. The moon was in the first quarter and setting about 9 pm. It was dark with stars that remind me of why I like to get out of the city. Like I said I was going up the road without a flashlight and feeling what was under my feet before putting weight on them so I would have lost a race against a snail.

I have my diaphragm calls, reed calls and the Hoochie Mama call. It was about 15 degrees so my hands were in my pockets with the Hoochie Mama call set on lost calf and I would not have to move to use it. The other thing was this was opening morning and after listening to the coyotes I was caught off guard by the bark, especially after standing still for five minutes. I was questioning myself it it was an elk or a coyote that had barked. It was a learning experience and next time I will cow call and see what happens. I still don't think they knew exactly what I was as they were still in there the rest of the hunt. I tried going in from the west and they were on the east side. I tried going in the next day on the east and they were on the west side. This summer I will see if I can find a way to come in from the south to the saddle they usually go over.

Once known as 3does,1buck pre-"upgrade" : It is better to rule than to serve.

Alright I know I'm a little late on this post, BUT....

BOGUS! I live in Reedsport and hunt up near Allegany.... I'm sure you know the area since I believe you're in Coos bay? Elk will run in ANY direction that allows them to get away from danger. I've used a Hoochie Momma cow call and another one that I can't remember the name of, but its a lip call. And you can bugle during that time, and I do quite a bit in the second half of the season because that's when the rut is picking up! I had a 6pt bull at 80 yards this year hollarin at me with 6 days left in the season, but he never gave me a shot. Hunt them hard but quiet, and be extremely careful about your scent. These elk around here spook really easy due to the amount of pressure they get during rifle season. Keep at it and good luck! I've attached a picture of my cow from last year. She was pretty good size, dressed out over 360lbs.

A buddy of mine here in Wyoming shot one close to that.  They called her Elkzilla!  Congrats, and good info!

Topgun 30-06
Agree with that!  The fewer spooked, the less distance they travel.  If you just bumped one or two, and the rest don't know what's going on (maybe, even the one ya bumped don't know?), they often won't go far.  300, 400, 500 or maybe 600 yards.
Dean
H2O

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Thanks for the congrats! I was really happy to get her. Primarily because it was my first big game kill... and the thrill of how the hunt went down... it was an amazing prize. I had the pelt tanned with the fur on and use it as a throw on my couch, and a blanket on my bed during the cold winter nights.

Happy New Year to all!!!
Well it's been close to a year since I posted this thread. I believe it has helped some that have replied here.  And I hope it has help others that are merely reading!  I also know that there are many here on the NAHC board that have savvy info about Wapiti hunts both successful and lacking, they can share.  We all learn from the kills, the misses and passed shots.
Step up and let us hear from ya!  Share your Wapiti knowledge!!!  I challenge all those of you that have hunted them regularly, to share your Savvy, and those who have yet to enjoy the work, challenge, and rewards, to ask away to those who have.

  I re-state the savvy question.

Savvy:   To understand or know; comprehend. (Second College Edition,  of the American Heritage Dictionary)
  I invite each of you savvy Elk hunters to share your knowledge here.  And all those seeking answers to your questions, ask them here!
  I'm not talkin about where to apply for your next tag, I'm talkin about huntin em.  Callin, stalking, glassin, getting around them, tracking, or out smarting them.  Water, feed, escape, migration, cover, camouflage, scents. glassing,.  Or anything  else about hunting em, ask it here!

Thanks to all that have shared what they know to those that read and post here.  I’ve learned and I’m sure others have too!  Happy New Year and full freezers in the fall, to all!!!

 

Dean

H2O Elkaholic

Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Read a post in another Elk forum that got my attention.  Would give credit to him here but don't remember even what web site I read it on.  Had to do with Elk bedding areas.  And that Elk bed in different areas during the day, than at nite.  After reading the post, it became clear to me that I have seen the same behavior.  I have seen Elk bedded right out in the open, in clearcuts, and meadows.  And yet most times, during the day I have found them bedded in thick (dark) timber, on benches or soft sloping north and east facing slopes.  The post made me think!  When I viewed bedded Elk, when did I see them, and the circumstances that I encountered them.

In my experience, I've encountered bedded Elk in the open when they where undisturbed.  I believe that when undisturbed, Elk will feed and bed down an chew there cuds, in or very near where the were feeding often out into the morning hours.  Commonly, elk hunters will find these beds and believe they are onto something hot.  As stated above, Elk will usually leave a lot of sign behind in bedding areas.  But hot at night, is not an Elk hunter goal!  Undisturbed Elk may return to these areas after day bedding for many nights.  The majority of the time, once the sun gets high in the sky (even undisturbed), the Elk are headed for dark more protected areas out of the sun.  When preasured, Elk will often be long gone from these areas before daylight.

Two, totally separate bedding areas!  One night time close to where they are feeding.  The other daytime, often miles away on close, dark, and north or east facing slopes.  Or on the closest, dark, benches.

Anyone else observe this?

Dean
H2O

NAHC Life Member 02/01/81 Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

In my experiences you are right on the money about bedding areas in timber country. Near where I live in WY the elk are migrating back to the plains and living there year round. They still bed on hillsides in the afternoon but seem to be 10 times more wily than antelope. They know where every two track is and watch them like a hawk. Long range stalk and shooting skills are a must.

Couple yrs ago I covered this for Dean on the old board. So far I haven't seen it here yet. Though I haven't read very far. There's a lot of great info & advice here. For those of you that don't bone out in the field and while field dressing find splitting the briskets on elk to be such a major job. This is how I was taught by the old time elk killers in our camp in the 50's & 60's. Instead of splitting the briskets. Skin along side the ribs, find the rib joints & Cut thru each one of them from the belly end to the throat on both sides. Then pull the whole thing out & toss it away. There's not much meat there anyway. --------- I like to cut 'em up in the snow because you can cool the meat down fast & thoroughly. Skin the top side off , then cut the qtrs off, back straps etc. Each hunk you cut off. Lay it out in the snow. Each time you take another piece to lay out. Flip the first one's over each time. By the time you finish cutting off all the meat sections the animal down to skeleton. All the meat hunks are so cold you can't hold 'em w/bare hands. Fill the cooler with snow. Layer the meat in it, cover with snow, more meat, then when it's full. Pack the holes & top with a layer of snow & then seal the cooler. I've kept meat like this over a week in fairly warm weather. Good luck to you, hope this helps, George

Boning out an elk is the only way to go if you have a long way to pack. Especialy if you are by yourself. A pack frame and canvas meat sacks are a good investment if you hunt elk in the back country where they like to hang out. I you have bagged a trophy that you want to mount, start by caping the animal.( I do not gut the animal, as that puts alot of stuff in your way that is unplesant and not nessesary).If not, just skin out the top half and start removing the backstrap from the spine. starting at the top of the neck back to the hip socket. Keep it clean and put it directly into the meat sack, or hang it in the shade to cool if it is warm out. Remove the meat from the shoulder and ribs, then the back leg. Keep the weight managable in the sacks. Turm the animal over and  repeat. When this is complete, you can go into the body cavity behind the ribs near the back bone to remove the tender loins.

Good info again.  Thanks to all that replied and those with questions.

Roy said;  "I you have bagged a trophy that you want to mount, start by caping the animal.( I do not gut the animal, as that puts alot of stuff in your way that is unplesant and not nessesary)."

Can you be more descriptive; capping the animal?  Where do you begin?  Skinning and capping a Wapiti without gutting it?  How?

Thanks again for posting, welcome to the club!!!

Dean
H2O Elkaholic

NAHC Life Member 02/01/81 Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

Dean,

        to start caping make a cut through the hide at about the end of the sternum (beginning of chest cavity) up over the back and down the other side to the point where you began. At the point you cut over the spine, make a nice straight cut up the point of the spine to the base of the skull. Start skinning from this cut down over the shoulders. At this point you can either tube out the front legs, or make a cut from the end of sternum (where you began) to the back of each front leg. There is kind of a line here where the fur comes from two directions. Cut down this line to the knee and cut the leg off. Continue skinning forward to the head. Try to cut the head off as close to the base of the skull as possible to reduce weight and have less meat to cool out. Strech the cape out in the shade to cool. If it is very warm out you might even cut the toungue out and prop the mouth open.

Dean,.. check out this link:

http://www.sagebasin.com/images/guide.doc

. There's room for all Gods creatures,.. right next to the taters' an' gravy! ,.........
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7mm Mag,

               wish I had known about this link. As Uncle Ted would say "Perfect". I am planning on doing a video on caping and boning out an elk this fall. Will post!

I want to thank everyone that posted or just read this post.  So much knowledge and advise about huntin the monarch of the timber and plains.  I personally can't thank those that contributed enough!!!

I've had complaints that the thread has become to long,  I disagree.  But I have started a new one "Savvy II".  I would hope anyone with Elk huntin questions would read through this one.  More raw Elk savvy in these pages than I have read anywhere else!  So many Elk savvy hunters have replied here,don't think we'll get much from a Savvy II, but it's up there.  If ya have a question, ask away!  Hope the Savvy hunters jump in as they did on this thread.

Thanks again, everyone!!!

Dean
H2O

NAHC Life Member 02/01/81 Hunting Elk in a rainforest; ya haven't experienced it till ya had rain running down the crack of your *** 30 minutes out of camp. Formerly a Roosevelt Elk hunter on the Washington coast, now hunting them Rocky Mtn. ones, in Wyoming.

to the top

ttt
Dean
H2O

Sorry guys. I'm bringing this back up, and savvy II. Think there was a lot of good info that drifited down and there are a bunch of new Elk hunters on here that can benifit by what was said. JMO
H2O

Thanx H2O appreciate it